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I've been a Cincy fan since the early 70's and have watched this team closely this year. Interesting thing about Griffey is that he may provide and indentity to the team for MLB fans outside of Cincinnati but I think the majority of Reds fans don't really see it that way. I for one am a huge Griffey fan and would like to see him finish his amazing career with a contender like the Mariners or Angels. How cool would it be to see him have an impact in the post season. And right now I think he is at the peak of his trade value so I think a deal needs to get done for a couple of young pitching prospects who can contribute in the future. Dunn has to have some value somewhere as well. I thought this team had the potential to contend this year with a mix of youth and some experienced professional hitters like Hatterberg and Conine but for some reason they have underachieved, and I do think that Narron's management style was a piece of that puzzle. It is time to make a trade or two and start rebuilding this franchise in earnest.

I also am i die hard Reds fan, and I agree with the comment before mine that Reds fans don't really see Griffey as the identity of the team. Players like Ryan Freel and Aaron Harang are the identity of the Reds, with Freel's unselfish team play and Harang's totally unnnoticed performance, those players are the identity. Players like Josh Hamilton and Brandon Phillips are also becoming solid pieces of the club. Griffey is no longer the player that Cincy people go to see at Great American Ballpark.

And I also agree that the Reds have uttered failed to perform this year. I really thought they had a shot at the Central or the Wild card

Ryan Freel is nothing more than a bench player, a bench player that would be nothing more than that if he played anywhere else, but in cincinnati he is viewed upon as a "Real Red". Until cincinnati looses the mentality that Ryan Freel > Adum Dunn, we will continue to hover around the worst teams in sports.

Ryan Freel a bench player?? Dude, you are way off base. This guy plays with more hustle and heart than 99% of the players in the league.

Hustle does not a starter make. He would be a better spot starter, utility guy. That way, if he goes down, you don't have to worry about it as much. Besides, who do you start him in place of?

You are right. The reds need 8 more players like freel to put up "impressive" numbers like Freel's 251 BA 2 hr and 12 RBIs. That would be a lineup to be feared. Oh wait, but he hustles and plays hard. Who cares how much he sucks or how little basebal talent he has. We need 8 more players like him so we can stack light hitting .250 hitters 1-9.

The reason this team sucks is due to the horrible pitching staff.

Yeah, so get off Freel's case.

Glad you agree that freel sucks, along with the pitching staff.

No, Freel does not suck.

If the Reds had 8 other players like freel then every hit you could possibly get would be a deep homerun because one of the freels has the speed, hustle, and hart to make every play. Ya, but other than in my opinion harang and weathers the pitching staff does suck.

Since this has degenerated into a Freel vs Dunn argument, it might be useful to compare their stats:
Freel - http://www.baseball-reference.com/f/freelry01.shtml
Dunn - http://www.baseball-reference.com/d/dunnad01.shtml

RC/27 for Freel is 3.72, and for Dunn is 6.81, so a lineup of Dunns would outscore a lineup of Freels by 3 runs a game.

No way the Reds will trade Griffey as he approaches 600 HR this year. Griffey, the identity of the club or not, does put people in the seats. People want to see Griffey hit a home run. Plus, people complain about how much Griffey makes, but we will never get a player of his caliber for that cheap again. When he left Seattle, he was arguably the best player in the game. He could have easily gone to a big market and gotten A-Rod type money ($25 million a year). However, he chose to come to the small-market Reds because thats where he grew up, and took a lot less money. I say wait until next year around this time to trade him, because at least he should have hit #600 by then, and if he keeps his health where it is right now, he will be easy to sell. The Reds have already lost 50 games this year, and if we trade Griffey now, there will be a maximum of 20,000 people at the games in August. Castellini is a very good business man, and I highly doubt he would make a move that would cause his attendance revenue to drop even more, while at the same time cause the fans to lose all trust in him.

Dunn needs to go .. watching him play the outfield is just plain painful! He's horrible - better get something out of him now too!! If it's not already too late ..

Jacob, are you arguing in your last line that the Reds are somehow not irrelevant because they have Griffey? The Reds have the worst record in baseball--trust me, they are the definition of irrelevant.

Likewise, I challenge your suggestion that Griffey is the identity of this team. Rather I would suggest the MYTH of the Return of Jr. is the identity of the Reds. I remember well the day when Carl Lindner, the then owner of the team, flew Jr. into town on his private jet. Not since the Bid Red Machine has there been so much promise around the Reds. Ever since that day, every year has been "the year" that he would become Jr. again and lead us to the promised land. This is still not the year--that year is NOT coming.

Until this sad season, I went to Riverfront/GABP 20+ games a year, and barely even need all my fingers to count the times I saw Griffey play in person. How can you be the team's identity if you never play? He is a great player and a great man, but he does not define, and never has defined, the team. (Would you have ever written this article if Sean Casey was still on the team? Many an honest Reds fan will admit his trade hurt their heart more than Griffey's ever will.) Ken Griffey, Jr. will always be the great "What if" for the Cincinnati Reds...

Growing up in Cincinnati and now living away it's been heartbreaking watching the team i cheered to a title as a kid fall this badly. I'm amazed at the difference between this year and last year...with the exception of not having Guardado they should have been nothing but better this year, but it's just night and day. As much as I hate to say it, the whole lineup needs to be gutted. Keep Griffey, Hamilton, Freel, and maybe Brandon Phillips. Harrang, Arroyo, and Bailey. Everyone else out the door. And they need to find the commitment to put at least a little more money into the roster. Offensive production from the infield is nothing short of pathetic - a couple good hitters on the corners teamed with Hamilton and Griffey (for a few more years at least) could make all the difference. Bullpen...god only knows. I'll leave that to better minds than mine. *shudder*

I liked Jerry Narron a lot, but this year some of his decisions were just baffling. The problem is going to be finding a quality manager willing to do the job now. The prospect of coaching Junior might help in the talent search.

P.S. Imagine if they hadn't gotten shafted on that Kearns/Lopez trade last year. Kearns is looking like a classic flare out but still had a lot of value last year. If they had been able to come away with two REAL relievers in that we might be in a different spot today.

I thought I should give my opinion on Dunn: I am a Cardinals fan, but the Reds should be offering Dunn, maybe somebody desperate and willing to make any trades for power and not knowing the future (usually 1 year) just caring about the now - *Ahem* Yankees - would be willing to make an arrangement for him. His power numbers are good, but you have to realize that he sucks at everthing else, strikes out 200+ times a year, so 40 or 50 some homers doesn't cut it also because he plays in one of the best hitters ballparks in MLB, Great American Ballpark. So his trade value has diminished in my opinion because he homers, but has the advantage of a great park, something like Todd Helton to Coors Field. Cardinals aren't doing so hot right now, but we're not the Yankees who think they can win every year. Adam Dunn does have talent though....his choice to use it. I'd go talk to Griffey Jr. and ask him what the strike zone is! Honestly! He's Helen Keller with a pinata party stick up there! So 40% on him, but the Reds suck, so i imagine his values up to 55% or so.

trade him to the cubs now for Jacque Jones :-) we will even throw in scott eyre to be nice

Ryan Freel is ok and I like having him around but the suggestion that he is more valuable than Dunn is off-base in my opinion. Freel can't even make it through a full season without having injury problems.

I say keep Griffey and Dunn around unless there are some really good offers. Losing those players will cause a decrease in revenue and hurt the Reds chances to be competitive next year. The Reds have to receive solid prospects and players in return to offset the aforementioned trading negatives.

I am a die hard Reds Fan, and I agree with some earlier posts that I expected a lot more out of this team. Griffey has to stay. The chase for 600 and then the chase Willie Mays are going to selling LOTS of tickets. It would be a shame after all of the frustration and disappointment of Griffey's unlucky injury plagued years, we give him up right before he makes a run at immortality. In the Steroid Era, Griffey's achievement is going to the a fantastic story.