MMA  > General MMA  > Little Nog's Impact...
September 10, 2010, 02:40 AM
Does he really stand a chance to make a splash in the LHW division? Or is he there because of his brother? Little Nog squares off against Ryan Bader, a formidable foe, does he take the win?
September 10, 2010  08:45 AM ET

hold on a second, Cyne.
Lil'Nog. has beaten the likes of Overeem (twice) and Hendo.
he also had an epic decision loss to Rua (who comfirmed that this was his hardest battle ever).

Meanwhile, who did Bader fight against? Nobody! His best opponent was Keith Jardine who's been cut from UFC for losing too much.

Bader haven't been tested at all so far.
And Nog has proven himself without the help of his brother as you imply. Moreover, it is my opinion that if anything, he doesn't get the attention he deserves exactly because people always compare his accomplishments with that of his brother, so he always stays in the back. But now that his brother is fading away from the top HW's, maybe it is the right time for lil'Nog to shine?

September 10, 2010  10:01 AM ET
QUOTE(#1):

hold on a second, Cyne.Lil'Nog. has beaten the likes of Overeem (twice) and Hendo.he also had an epic decision loss to Rua (who comfirmed that this was his hardest battle ever).Meanwhile, who did Bader fight against? Nobody! His best opponent was Keith Jardine who's been cut from UFC for losing too much. Bader haven't been tested at all so far.And Nog has proven himself without the help of his brother as you imply. Moreover, it is my opinion that if anything, he doesn't get the attention he deserves exactly because people always compare his accomplishments with that of his brother, so he always stays in the back. But now that his brother is fading away from the top HW's, maybe it is the right time for lil'Nog to shine?

He doesn't get the attention because for his last 8 fights he has been fighting cans.........

September 10, 2010  10:02 AM ET

He should.

He was one of the uncrowned heros of Pride, and should go down as one of the top 10 at 205. Overeem twice, Hendo, ext. Plus I scored the Shogun fight for Nogueira, and one cannot deny that he tooled Shogun standing, rocking him many times with punches on the feet.

If you have the BJJ to tap Dan and Nakamura, and be a South American gold medalist boxer who dominated Shogun standing for two great rounds, then I will favor you against any man on the planet at your weight class.

September 10, 2010  10:04 AM ET

Roni you speak as if he beat Overeem the way he is today. Those fights took place 4 and 5 years ago when Overeem was at LHW. And if you notice he lost all 3 fights at LHW before moving up to HW full time...... Not the same Overeem that we see today.

September 10, 2010  11:09 AM ET
QUOTE(#4):

Roni you speak as if he beat Overeem the way he is today. Those fights took place 4 and 5 years ago when Overeem was at LHW. And if you notice he lost all 3 fights at LHW before moving up to HW full time...... Not the same Overeem that we see today.

That is true.

Alistair was however still a top 10 205 pounder at that point, and the wins are still relevant.

September 10, 2010  11:20 AM ET
QUOTE(#2):

He doesn't get the attention because for his last 8 fights he has been fighting cans.........

that's different.
Pride folded, not his fault.
He only joined UFC now, so he didn't have the fighters available until now.

September 10, 2010  12:21 PM ET
QUOTE(#6):

that's different. Pride folded, not his fault.He only joined UFC now, so he didn't have the fighters available until now.

He could have went anywhere and fought anyone with who his brother was, and from his resume of who he has fought. He chose not to do that.

September 10, 2010  12:28 PM ET
QUOTE(#7):

He could have went anywhere and fought anyone with who his brother was, and from his resume of who he has fought. He chose not to do that.

are you kidding me, Scott? why all the hate, bro?
He didn't join a top promotion and this is why he didn't fight top guys.

it is not as simple as wishing to fight someone and doing it... not that simple.

You wave away also the fact that he was the hardest battle Shogun has ever fought?
Do you forget that he was a top guy in pride?

I mean, how far will you go to try and discredit a guy who's proven he is a top contender?

September 10, 2010  12:31 PM ET
QUOTE(#8):

it is not as simple as wishing to fight someone and doing it... not that simple.

and by not that simple, look no further than randy & Fedor.

Same there, i don't think any promotion would gladly allow their fighters to fight someone without a contract. So he had to settle down and negotiate with a big promotion.

maybe he didn't want to follow his brother's footsteps yet. Maybe what UFC offered him was not good enough at the time. There are many unknowns on this, but the fact remains that Nog was always a top guy at his weightclass.
to try and demerit him is to deny the truth.

yes, he fought lesser guys, but it is not because he was let go of his promotion. Pride went under. As simple as that.

September 10, 2010  12:39 PM ET
QUOTE(#8):

are you kidding me, Scott? why all the hate, bro?He didn't join a top promotion and this is why he didn't fight top guys.it is not as simple as wishing to fight someone and doing it... not that simple.You wave away also the fact that he was the hardest battle Shogun has ever fought?Do you forget that he was a top guy in pride?I mean, how far will you go to try and discredit a guy who's proven he is a top contender?

Not hateing at all... Just calling things the way I see them.

Nog chose not to go to a company where he could have faced top competition. I haven't forgotten at all about his battles in pride, but what does that have to do with him right now? After Pride he could have easilly joined the UFC just like his brother and shogun and Wandy and Rampage and Hendo etc..... He chose not to do that. What other company can offer much competition at the LHW division. Unlike the HW division when Pride folded....

September 10, 2010  12:42 PM ET
QUOTE(#9):

and by not that simple, look no further than randy & Fedor. Same there, i don't think any promotion would gladly allow their fighters to fight someone without a contract. So he had to settle down and negotiate with a big promotion.maybe he didn't want to follow his brother's footsteps yet. Maybe what UFC offered him was not good enough at the time. There are many unknowns on this, but the fact remains that Nog was always a top guy at his weightclass. to try and demerit him is to deny the truth.yes, he fought lesser guys, but it is not because he was let go of his promotion. Pride went under. As simple as that.

You can't compare lig Nog's situation to Fedor and Randy. Both were under contracts and the appeal to Fedor was better outside of the UFC at the time he left Pride. Who did the UFC have at the time at HW when Fedor chose a different company? Tim Sylvia, Arlovski, Randy... That was it.

Lil Nog didn't have the same choices when he left. The UFC was already the deepest company at LHW so why he refused to sign is a mystery to me.

September 10, 2010  12:43 PM ET
QUOTE(#10):

Not hateing at all... Just calling things the way I see them.Nog chose not to go to a company where he could have faced top competition. I haven't forgotten at all about his battles in pride, but what does that have to do with him right now? After Pride he could have easilly joined the UFC just like his brother and shogun and Wandy and Rampage and Hendo etc..... He chose not to do that. What other company can offer much competition at the LHW division. Unlike the HW division when Pride folded....

er... are you forgetting that UFC didn't have much to offer at that time?
Shogun joind not long ago. Bader or Bones didn't exist, rashad was still dreaming of TUF, etc...

and why are you being naive?
These things are contracts, negotiations.
How do you know if UFC even wanted him to join? Maybe they didn't like his old contract. maybe they didn't even make an offer.

it is not as simple as "he could have joined". We don't even know if UFC would want him!

September 10, 2010  12:48 PM ET
QUOTE(#11):

You can't compare lig Nog's situation to Fedor and Randy. Both were under contracts and the appeal to Fedor was better outside of the UFC at the time he left Pride. Who did the UFC have at the time at HW when Fedor chose a different company? Tim Sylvia, Arlovski, Randy... That was it.Lil Nog didn't have the same choices when he left. The UFC was already the deepest company at LHW so why he refused to sign is a mystery to me.

again, you put it as it was a simple choice to join UFC.
It is a long contract in which both parties have to agree.
Maybe the UFC didn't want him to join.
Maybe he was not a priority (UFC first dealt with the champs contracts, then the rest of it)

Second, maybe he was looking for other places, and that took time.

Again, you put it as he simply chose to fight cans and not join the UFC...
Truth of the matter is that we don't know if it was his choice or UFC's not to have him at that time..

September 10, 2010  12:51 PM ET
QUOTE(#12):

er... are you forgetting that UFC didn't have much to offer at that time?Shogun joind not long ago. Bader or Bones didn't exist, rashad was still dreaming of TUF, etc...and why are you being naive?These things are contracts, negotiations. How do you know if UFC even wanted him to join? Maybe they didn't like his old contract. maybe they didn't even make an offer.it is not as simple as "he could have joined". We don't even know if UFC would want him!

You are right I don't know and neither do you. So how can you sit here and call me me naive and the do the exact same thing? We are both speculating on why he didn't fight the top competition. All we both know is that in his last 8 fights he hasn't fought the top competition, and thats why he doesn't get the consideration that some think he deserves.

Are you serious about the UFC not having anything to offer at LHW at the time??? Please say you are joking.
Hendo, Rampage, Liddell, Forrest.....

The UFC was very deep at LHW when Nog went to Affliction...

September 10, 2010  01:07 PM ET
QUOTE(#14):

You are right I don't know and neither do you. So how can you sit here and call me me naive and the do the exact same thing? We are both speculating on why he didn't fight the top competition. All we both know is that in his last 8 fights he hasn't fought the top competition, and thats why he doesn't get the consideration that some think he deserves.Are you serious about the UFC not having anything to offer at LHW at the time??? Please say you are joking.Hendo, Rampage, Liddell, Forrest.....The UFC was very deep at LHW when Nog went to Affliction...

heh. that's the thing.
I am not the one pointing out he "could have joined the UFC if he wanted".
I just accept he was not in any big promotion and thus didn't fight better guys.

I also point that as soon as he joined, he fought Cane (who was at one point the top contender in UFC) and then was supposed to fight an ex-champ in Forrest.

So all in all, I am not assuming anything. You are the one doing it.

September 10, 2010  01:13 PM ET
QUOTE(#14):

Hendo, Rampage, Liddell, Forrest.....

I am serious.
If a declining Liddell and Forrest was the best you could surmount as the best of the division, you are basically saying I was right :)

About hendo & rampage, I agree. they were there. but they were newcomers, and again, we do not know, but I would say that UFC probably set as priority to get Rampage & hendo ahead of lil'Nog.
Fact is, they were the top of the division, thus obviously a priority over anyone else.

Then lil Nog probably found some fights to keep busy and that kept him from the bargaining table.

I don't think he ditched UFC. And I can see plainly that UFC had other priorities in contract negotiations to let Nog fight until they were ready to sit and talk.

What I think is preposterous to think Nog would decline UFC to fight cans and then join them later... THAT, my friend, would make no sense.

Comment #17 has been removed
September 10, 2010  02:38 PM ET
QUOTE(#16):

I am serious.If a declining Liddell and Forrest was the best you could surmount as the best of the division, you are basically saying I was right :)About hendo & rampage, I agree. they were there. but they were newcomers, and again, we do not know, but I would say that UFC probably set as priority to get Rampage & hendo ahead of lil'Nog.Fact is, they were the top of the division, thus obviously a priority over anyone else.Then lil Nog probably found some fights to keep busy and that kept him from the bargaining table.I don't think he ditched UFC. And I can see plainly that UFC had other priorities in contract negotiations to let Nog fight until they were ready to sit and talk.What I think is preposterous to think Nog would decline UFC to fight cans and then join them later... THAT, my friend, would make no sense.

You are speaking of today. I am speaking of a few years ago. How many years ago did Pride fold? So you are telling me Forrest and Hendo were both declining as well as Liddell in 2006, because thats when Pride closed its doors....
The UFC also at the time had Babalu and Randy in the LHW divison as well.

Nog's last match in Pride was a loss against Sokoudjou. Considered to be a very big upset in MMA. He took some time off and then he decided to sign a contract with Affliction. Notice I said he decided to not forced to.

How long did it take Lil Nog to join the UFC? Rampage Joined and fought at UFC 67.... and Hendo joined the UFC in 2007 and fought at UFC 78 and it took Nog until AUG of 2009 for UFC 106....

September 10, 2010  02:39 PM ET
QUOTE(#17):

I saw this thread and said to myself "I bet Roni and Scott are going back and forth on this one." I think Bader wins this fight, and climbs the ladder.

hahahahahahahahahaha.... Its all in fun

 
September 10, 2010  03:23 PM ET

ok, I mentioned a "a declining chuck" and also Forrest, didn't mean that forrest was declining.
IMO he is not that great. he did beat Rampage, but I don't think Griffin should ever be considered top tier of MMA.

Just to be clear, I LIKE him. I just don't think he is gifted.

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