MMA  > General MMA  > Guida vs Pettis: the aftermath
June 6, 2011, 08:23 AM
I don't know about the rest of you guys but I for one think Clay Guida is the absolute most boring fighter out there.

And as a MMA fan it make me sick to think that some of you guys accept him as a good fighter and deserving of a title shot. Not all of you but some of you.

Now don't get me wrong cause I know he deserved the decision based on todays scoring standards but if you watched the fight, tell me what did he do to really deserve the win?

I'll tell you what he did, Takedown and hold, takedown and hold, takedown and hold.

I would give pettis they decision just for his work on his back alone! He threw punches, had wrist control, and made submission attempts. and that was from his back. What did Guida do when on top? Not much of anything.

Now don't get me wrong takedowns should count for something but if you can't do anything with them once your down there you shouldn't be rewarded for just sitting there.

If he took him down and attempted to pass guard and go for the victory via strikes or submission then i'm all for it. but he didn't try once.

And lets be honest we see this all to often when an exciting fighter loses a fight by decision to a great wrestler because of takedowns and lay n pray.

UFC has the ability to change the scoring or change the amount of time the fight is on the ground with no attempts to improve position or throw strikes (not those little baby hammer fists), or go for submissions.

Anyway this fight almost reminded me of the King Mo vs Gegard Mousasi and that was a huge disapointment.

Am I the only one that feels this way?
June 6, 2011  09:16 AM ET

Its the trend in MMA. It will not change until the rules and scoring changes. Why should Guida do anything more? He knows by doing the bare minimum and getting takedowns he wins the fight.

This fight was nothing like the King Mo/ Moussasi fight. In that fight Gegard actually did more damage from the bottom. He made King Mo's face look like it was hit with a bat.

So the real question is why should MMA change the rules? People are still buying the PPV's more than ever. That tells them that people want to see more of what is going on. If you want to see change in the rules quit purchasing the PPV's. Then they might get the point that people don't want to pay to see a college wrestling match. Until then get used to it because that is the way MMA is heading. Lay n Pray college wrestlers winning by decision.

June 6, 2011  10:18 AM ET
QUOTE(#1):

Its the trend in MMA. It will not change until the rules and scoring changes. Why should Guida do anything more? He knows by doing the bare minimum and getting takedowns he wins the fight.This fight was nothing like the King Mo/ Moussasi fight. In that fight Gegard actually did more damage from the bottom. He made King Mo's face look like it was hit with a bat.So the real question is why should MMA change the rules? People are still buying the PPV's more than ever. That tells them that people want to see more of what is going on. If you want to see change in the rules quit purchasing the PPV's. Then they might get the point that people don't want to pay to see a college wrestling match. Until then get used to it because that is the way MMA is heading. Lay n Pray college wrestlers winning by decision.

Well I sure as poop haven't been buying these ppv events as much as I used to.

I'll give you 2 reasons.

1. the price was raised to $55

2. the watered down events. We used to get 2 title fights in an event. now we are lucky to get 1 title fight.

June 6, 2011  10:21 AM ET

Now all we get is Dana White feeding us **** that these TUF fighters are top of the heap fighters and that they are worth my $55 dollars

June 6, 2011  11:56 AM ET

I heard this on MMA Nation last night. Did he lay and prey? yeah, they said if pettis just stopped the ref would of picked them up. But when i went back to watch i got bored and skipped round 2.

June 6, 2011  12:25 PM ET

If the refs need to treat inactivity on the ground the same way they do clinches in boxing . pick them up. they separate clinched fighters so the better fighter can maximize his opportunities. while the weaker fighter cant hold on and avoid fighting

that appears to be what some wrestlers are doing. im not saying they are good fighters but one or two takedowns and then sitting in someones guard is hiding .either advance or stand up and takehim down again and again NO STITTING AND WAITING

June 6, 2011  12:39 PM ET

If the other fighter can't avoid the takedown I'm all for the judges recognizing that but that can't be what wins the fight for the inactive wrestler. They should lose points for stalling. If they are actually trying to advance posistion with no luck, thats fine atleast they are trying. but after a few failed attempts stand them up.

June 6, 2011  12:43 PM ET
QUOTE(#6):

If the other fighter can't avoid the takedown I'm all for the judges recognizing that but that can't be what wins the fight for the inactive wrestler. They should lose points for stalling. If they are actually trying to advance posistion with no luck, thats fine atleast they are trying. but after a few failed attempts stand them up.

and if no real attempt to advance posistion or finish the fight stand them up faster.

June 6, 2011  01:02 PM ET

Here is the deal.

Scoring is done on effective striking, grappling, and ring generalship.

Striking: Clearly went to Pettis, in every round. Unless you count sholdering his stomach more than punches to the face:)

Effectiv grappling: Who did more damage on the ground? Undoubtedly Pettis, who landed more blows and had wrist control for a majority of the fight, threating with multiple armbars and triangles in every round. Guida attempted no submissions, and ony achieved one dominant poistion (well, two, but both at te same time).

In neither of the first two rounds did he get mount, achieve side mount, or attain back mount. He was in half guard some, but being in a halfguard with lockdown is NOT an advantageous position. I bet you that Zero of the judges there even know what lockdown is.

The only round you can make a case for Guida winning this criteria is, is the third round, when he achieved a fleeting side mount and back mount. But Pettis did the same in that round, and he had a takedown that landed him directly into mount, which under the unified rules is worth more than a direct into guard takedown.

Agression: Depends on what you prefer. Walking forward and bobbing your upper body or trying to hurt your opponent with strikes.

Ring Generalship: A wash. Guida was effective in moving forward, but Pettis was able to create angles that kept him from getting trapped. That is the real meaning of "octagon control" not just moving forward and not throwing strikes.

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June 6, 2011  02:44 PM ET
QUOTE(#8):

Here is the deal. Scoring is done on effective striking, grappling, and ring generalship. Striking: Clearly went to Pettis, in every round. Unless you count sholdering his stomach more than punches to the face:)Effectiv grappling: Who did more damage on the ground? Undoubtedly Pettis, who landed more blows and had wrist control for a majority of the fight, threating with multiple armbars and triangles in every round. Guida attempted no submissions, and ony achieved one dominant poistion (well, two, but both at te same time). In neither of the first two rounds did he get mount, achieve side mount, or attain back mount. He was in half guard some, but being in a halfguard with lockdown is NOT an advantageous position. I bet you that Zero of the judges there even know what lockdown is.The only round you can make a case for Guida winning this criteria is, is the third round, when he achieved a fleeting side mount and back mount. But Pettis did the same in that round, and he had a takedown that landed him directly into mount, which under the unified rules is worth more than a direct into guard takedown.Agression: Depends on what you prefer. Walking forward and bobbing your upper body or trying to hurt your opponent with strikes.Ring Generalship: A wash. Guida was effective in moving forward, but Pettis was able to create angles that kept him from getting trapped. That is the real meaning of "octagon control" not just moving forward and not throwing strikes.

Wait a tic are you saying Guida did not deserve the decision?

I agree with you

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June 6, 2011  06:26 PM ET
QUOTE(#12):

Based on how judges score fights he won the fight. Pettis should have stopped the takedowns, simple as that.

Agreed. And given that Pettis isn't skilled in that area, he should have also played to the scoring and used his skills to try and stand back up. Instead he focussed on with fighting from the bottom, securing wrist control, and looking for the sub from the bottom.
He said that himself after the fight. He could have used his athleticism to sweep. He could have opened things up and traded a lot more rather than working towards neutralization.
Since neither did damage, the guy on top is obviously going to get the credit for putting the fight where he wanted to.
All Guida has is wrestling, cardio, and heart. Pettis beats him soundly across the board in everything else. So Guida corrected played to his only strengths.

I wish the refs would stand guys up more often, too. It seems like a simple enough tweak and would be good for the sport.

That Mousasi-King Mo fight is a better example mentioned up there. Pettis didn't damage Guida. King Mo, on the other hand, looked like he had been hit in the face with a baseball bat.

June 6, 2011  07:05 PM ET
QUOTE(#14):

Agreed. And given that Pettis isn't skilled in that area, he should have also played to the scoring and used his skills to try and stand back up. Instead he focussed on with fighting from the bottom, securing wrist control, and looking for the sub from the bottom. He said that himself after the fight. He could have used his athleticism to sweep. He could have opened things up and traded a lot more rather than working towards neutralization. Since neither did damage, the guy on top is obviously going to get the credit for putting the fight where he wanted to. All Guida has is wrestling, cardio, and heart. Pettis beats him soundly across the board in everything else. So Guida corrected played to his only strengths. I wish the refs would stand guys up more often, too. It seems like a simple enough tweak and would be good for the sport. That Mousasi-King Mo fight is a better example mentioned up there. Pettis didn't damage Guida. King Mo, on the other hand, looked like he had been hit in the face with a baseball bat.

Yoda, He did get back to his feet a few times

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June 6, 2011  09:44 PM ET
QUOTE(#16):

The most exciting part was the whole god damn thing. Guida won me $440.

thats awesome. maybe i wouldnt be complaining if i bet on him too

June 7, 2011  11:49 AM ET
QUOTE(#13):

Fightmetric disagrees with you. Guida outstruck Pettis. Guida had 5 takedowns to none. Guida had half guard twice with 1 pass to side and back once. Pettis had side and back once. Guida won the fight without question.http://blog.fightmetric.com/2011/06/guida-vs-pettis-official-ufc- statistic s.html

I gree with the fact that he won the fight with todays scoring standards but how about if you just be honest with yourself and look at the the fight went down.

Yes Guida took pettis down about 5 times. and pettis was able to get back to his feet twice I believe. How many submission attempts did Guiga attempt vs how many Pettis attempted? do those not count for something?

 
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