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  • January 14, 2008 06:20 AM ET

Me Vs Steve Aschburner . . . . . . . . . . Part II

You want to play a game? (891-263-54) vs T-fo is Medium Pimpin' (132-64-14)
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His recent Column States 10 players that belong in the Hall of Fame

2. Dennis Johnson

I would state he does NOT belong in the Hall of Fame

agree with Steve?

ThrowDown!


I've looked over your three submissions, and tend to agree with the others, but the late great Dennis Johnson belongs in the Hall of Fame. Some players get in because they are compilers of huge numbers, others because of their involvement in multiple championships. Still others get in because of their great defensive prowess.

DJ was a combination of all of the above.

He was a part of 3 championship teams...once in Seattle and twice with the Celtics. (winning Finals MVP with the Sonics)

Although he wasn't a huge compiler of any individual stats, but when he retired, he was one of only ELEVEN NBA players to have amassed more than 15,000 points and 5,000 assists. That's pretty rare company.

In addition to his offensive skills, DJ was well known for his defensive prowess, being named for nine consecutive years to the NBA All-Defensive team.

Sometimes, you need to look at a players entire spectrum of a career to determine their status in history. Dennis Johnson belongs in the Hall of Fame.


He was a part of 3 championship teams...once in Seattle and twice with the Celtics. (winning Finals MVP with the Sonics)

So? Robert Horry has SIX rings does he get in as well? Scott Williams and Luc Longley both have 3 as well - do they get a spot before Sir Charles?


5 allstar games in 14 years- not a good % there

Made 2 All-NBA Teams in 14 years - Not to great there

NEVER in top 10 in steals - as a Guard this is VERY rare to be all defense team and not make the steals list. In Fact- averaged 1.3 spg over his career.

he averaged 14.1 ppg finally-

I'm not saying he was a scrub- I'm saying he does not belong in the Hall of FAME- Hall of very good- hall of having a great year- hall of Awesome post season run (along with sleepy flloyd) - yes

But at 14 ppg as a Guard? Not the Hall of Fame.


I would once again ask that you look at his career as a whole, not at individual categories...

Look at Big Game Bob's entire career, not just his rings...the same as Williams and Longley. Poof...up in smoke, because there is nothing else compelling about their case.

Don't just look at his points per game, look at the double threat he was in both points AND assists. Off the top of my head, I'll use Brian Westbrook as an example. If you only looked at his rushing stats you might not think too much, but when you look at both his rushing and receiving stats together you begin to see that he is truly a stud.

I also need to correct an error on your part...DJ played only 13 years (according to NBA.com), not 14.

5-time all-star, 2-time all NBA, 9-time all-defensive team, 3 time NBA champion, one of only 11 players with 15,000 points and 5,000 assists. The big picture says he's a Hall of Famer.

But you don't have to listen to me, once again, from NBA.com - In Sports Illustrated, teammate Bird, who was not known for lightly tossing around compliments, called Johnson "the best I've ever played with."


You've given the Bird Quote- let me remind you of another quote by Magic Johnson

" XXX has as much or more talent than anyone I ever played with"

Who was it? See Below

ok let me give you a player

Also 6'5 also a SG

Made 4 all star games 1 less than your guy

Has 1.4 spg - more than your guy

Made 17.1 ppg 3 points more than yopur guy

also got All NBA first team Also got All Defensive team

Comparative? Seems like it to me

This PLayer?

Latrell Sprewell

let me give you another player

Guard - 6 Defensive Teams, 4 All Star games, Defensive PLAYER OF THE YEAR
Lead LEAGUE in STEALS 3 times Well over TWICE DJs Spg PLUS also scored 14ppg.

this player? Just as good (or better) Defensive as DJ? Just as good a scorer?

Alvin Robertson

And you make a lot of the 15/5 Club- actually there are 16 members now- there was 11 when DJ retired.

You know who is also on that list?

Jeff Hornacek more points, more assists

Guess who is on the 16000 and 6000 assist club - MORE Than DJ?

Derek Harper - you putting him in the Hall too?


oh and that player?

Anthony Peel


Latrell Sprewell - zero championships
Alvin Robertson - zero championships
Jeff Hornacek - zero championships
Derek Harper - zero championships

Dennis Johnson - three championships...and not just as a role player, as a KEY player.

In leading Seattle to their only title, DJ was named MVP of the Finals.

With the Celtics he was part of some epic finals, including the Lakers in 1984, when he was handed the assignment of handling Magic Johnson and basically shut him down.

You can't just compare career numbers of a bunch of players, you also have to take a look at what that player did to excel during their career. DJ was a clutch performer, a shooter you could depend on when you need a basket, a defender who could go toe to toe with the best and shut them down, and a guy who flat out hustled with all he had to give. He was a major player on some of the biggest stages the NBA had to offer. Don't just honor the compilers, honor the effort of a man worthy of the Hall of Fame.

January 14, 2008  11:41 AM ET

Initially voted for TFo but the arguments from NC especially the last made me change my vote.

January 14, 2008  12:01 PM ET

I feel DJ should be in the Hall, but the arguments being presented have me vote to the left.

Correction: Robert Horry doesn't have 6 championships... he has 7.

January 14, 2008  12:13 PM ET

Players are always going to back their guy, ala Bird supporting DJ

<------------------------------------------------------------ -----------------

January 14, 2008  12:19 PM ET

oops on Horry- I missed one I keep thinking 2,2, and 2 with him - know him and Kerr combos for 12 and keep splitting them instead of Kerr 5 and Horry 7

January 14, 2008  12:48 PM ET

great TD - vote to t-fo. Its not DJ's fault there are other players deserving of hof that are not in.

January 14, 2008  01:06 PM ET

I think, DJ, that in Bird's case, you have to consider there was some pretty strong company to keep on those Celtic teams. There were some pretty fine ballers there, and it's not like Bird went around saying; "McHale - best ever"..."Parrish - best ever". He reserved that commentary for Dennis Johnson.

 
January 14, 2008  09:27 PM ET

^ see my Magic quote in Arg 3

and I'm not saying DJ was a scrub - he had a GREAT year in the Seattle champ

But like Roger Maris when he hit 61 - great year HOF YEAR but did not make a HOF career.

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