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Favrefan says GO USA!! won the Throwdown.

Basketball Jesus: CHAMPION!

Throwndowns: 320
Record: 223 - 83 - 14
Pocatello, ID
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Throwndowns: 141
Record: 103 - 32 - 6
Mc Lean , VA
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All No-title team

Favrefan says GO USA!! said 02/12, 07:40 PM
Make a starting lineup consisting of players who never got the ring.

PG- John Stockton: as close to a no-brainer as you can get

SG- George Gervin: the best scoring SG ever before MJ.

SF- Elgin Baylor: perhaps the saddest story of all, retiring the same year his Lakers finally won it

PF- Karl Malone: second all time in points. Was a tough pick over Sir Charles here.

C- Patrick Ewing: Came close in the strike year, but never got it.

Basketball Jesus: CHAMPION! said 02/12, 08:56 PM
I'll be replacing Elgin Baylor with Charles Barkley on my team.

Baylor retired in the middle of the 1971-72 season. Immediately after his retirement the Lakers won 33 straight games, and won the title.

Both Baylor and Barkley never won titles. But Baylor played with Jerry West, the logo himself, for virtually his entire career. He went to the finals 8 times and never won once, with a hall of fame guard by his side. That's inexcusable.

In comparison, the best player Barkley played with might have been Dan Majerle. (Yes, he played with a couple outstanding players (Dr. J, Pippen) , but they were all washed up).

Charles said it best. "Magic Johnson got to raise the level of James Worthy's game. Michael Jordan got to raise the level of Scottie Pippen's game. But I got to raise the level of Shelton Jones's game."

Barkley was one of the most efficient shooters of all time. He's second all time in 2 point FG% (only Artis Gilmore tops him).

Barkley: .541 FG%
Baylor: .431 FG%

Note: I know it's hard to compare across different eras, but Barkley was still the much better shooter.

Favrefan says GO USA!! said 02/12, 09:15 PM
No, wait. Barkley for Baylor? Barkley was a PF, Baylor was a SF. I'm not really sure how to argue here. If I was facing more of a rookie I'd insist on a forfeit, but i figure you are experienced enough to pull something out. What exactly is it?

You can't fault Baylor for never winning a title, he had to go against the Celtics. Baylor was a remarkable scorer, and the fact that he made so many finals should be more of an indication of his success than a detraction. Wouldn't you say a guy with eight finals appearances was more successful than a guy with one?

Furthermore, how's about this: the 76ers won the title in 1983 and then drafted Barkley the next offseason. After getting him they never won another. The Rockets were coming off consecutive titles when they got Barkley in a trade, and have yet to win another. Weak for the resume' of Sir Charles.

Still, I'm having a difficult time comparing Barkley and Baylor since THEY PLAYED DIFFERENT POSITIONS!

Basketball Jesus: CHAMPION! said 02/12, 09:32 PM
I should've clarified this in my first argument. On my team I won't really be playing with a small forward or power forward per se, but really with two forwards. Barkley was a great low post player, but a great jump shooter as well. I plan on having Malone spend more time on the block, while having Barkley in the high post.

Those Celtic teams were historically great, but to go 0 for 8 against them? That's unexcusable.

Right after drafting Charles Barkley, Dr. J's game deteriorated fast, and within 3 years he retired. Moses Malone got traded away just a year later. Barkley was left pretty much alone. The 2nd best player on the team was Cliff Robinson.

If you really think this TD is unfair, then I will forfeit. I didn't interpret a team as something where you absolutely needed an orthodox small forward, power forward, etc. I thought of it assemble the best combination of any 5 players.

Favrefan says GO USA!! said 02/12, 09:34 PM
I made myself unclear as well, I apologize. I meant to see who the PG to never win a title was, Best SG to never win a title, etc. I didn't mean to make the best possible team. Draw?

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