The NBA should not expand to Europe.
Tonight....You said 02/14, 02:59 PM
There is no reason that the NBA needs to put 5 teams in Europe and they will be throwing money down the Latrine if they do.
1. The US market is not saturated to the point where it even warrants 5 more teams in the US. The first half of the season is virtually useless and the finals yield low viewership despite usually featuring either extremely strong and deep teams, or the poster children for the league.
2. There is a 5 hour gap between GMT and EST. Does anybody remember how annoying it is to watch the world cup or the olympics when it's in Europe or Asia? You have to be up at like 3:30am to catch live action and watching an already-taped rerun is even more stale nowadays since you can access news online and find out results before you even get to watch. Not to mention the fact that a west conference team would be almost 180'd on their sleep schedule when they play road games.
3. A handful of foreign players does not translate into some economic opportunity for the league.
There's no way european teams would benefit the league. It would just be a side show that dies within 5 years due to lack of interest and ridiculous logistics.
BSchwartz07 said 02/14, 03:13 PM
I wasn't going to do this, but then I read your argument, and well you make a good case TO put teams in Europe.
Your #1- Ratings are slipping here in the US, and people aren't even watching the Finals.
Answer- Why not try to expand your viewers and fans? The most watched games of the year have been ones involving international players. Even WNBA players are leaving for Europe. That means that they are even willing to watch WNBA players, no city in the US is willing to do that.
Your #2- Time change, this is a pretty easy fix. I mean there are international leagues all over the place. All you have to do is schedule team to have European road trips every so often. This way teams leave and play all 5 teams in one trip, jet lag is overrated (I would know It's 11PM here)
Your #3- A Handful of players? Not so much my friend. If you have forgotten the US didn't even claim the gold in the last Olympics. Foreign teams are selling out with scrubs that couldn't cut it in the NBA, and NBA games are viewed as much out of the US as they are IN the US. There is life outside of the US, I know it's crazy, but there is.
Tonight....You said 02/14, 03:52 PM
The reason games featuring foreign players draw larger numbers is because it's usually better teams playing. I'm sure you're thinking of players like Dirk, steve nash, tony parker, yao ming, and manu ginobili when you make that statement, right? they're all on good teams and are considered stars. Numbers should go higher when good teams are featured. On the contrast, nobody cares about the hornets outside of new orleans and they have Geyja on their team....isn't he a croatian sensation?...and croatia has one of the longest histories of NBA pedigree in Europe.
#2. It's really easy to SUGGEST road trips where teams go to Europe for all five games, but until YOU PRODUCE a schedule that functions correctly, YOU really can't say that it will work. every game on every night happens in part because of every other game that is happening on that night any given night during the season. and what happens to the European squads? Do they go on some sort of 30 game road trip before they have a 30 game home stand?
And Argentina won the championship so maybe we should put a team there first.
BSchwartz07 said 02/14, 04:03 PM
When I talk about sellouts and fans watching games think of guys like Yao, the Rockets are hardly the class of the NBA yet the guy is a MEGA Star in Asia. This sport is growing overseas while people don't really care in the US.
I mean you even admit that people aren't even watching the Finals. At this point the NBA is starting to see that they have a growing fan base OUTSIDE of the US. Now they shouldn't capitalize on that because you don't want to watch a game at 2 AM? I mean from what you are saying most people in the US aren't watching anyway.
Do yourself a favor and Google a soccer stadium in Europe, it makes "The Big House" look like "The Tiny Guest House", so the sports fans are there. You don't think they can sell out a 30,000 seat Arena? Please, and at the same team they CAN'T get half that in the US.
As for the road trips, jet lag is nothing that can't be cured with a good night's sleep. And in the NBA teams rarely play on back to back nights. It isn't a stretch to give a team 2-3 days to travel over, play 3-4 games and then 2-3 days to travel back.
Why give up MILLIONS of FANS? Are people he going to stop watching? I doubt that.
Tonight....You said 02/14, 04:22 PM
yes it is something to schedule games like that. Teams basically play 3-4 games a week. they don't have 4-6 days to blow off for travel. You didn't even address what I said about scheduling either. It's still just vague assumptions of what a team COULD do, not what it actaully is able to do in a real scenario.
And I play soccer and I love it, but just like the US can't fill a stadium for a soccer game, Europe would have the same difficulty filling a stadium for a basketball game. NFL europe went out of business and it's the new national passtime in the US. People are rabid for soccer in Europe and it can barely get on ESPN in america.
and the rockets are 32-20 as of right now...the only reason you don't hear about them much is because they are 4th place in their conference behind NO, SA, and Dallas, and only 4.5 games from first at that. It's the most competitive conference this year. and And China holds 20% of the world's population, which is why Yao is a "megastar". come on now.
and if 5 teams MUST go to europe and the US can't hold interest, then 5 teams need to MOVE to europe instead of adding 5 to the total and streching the talent pool even thinner.
BSchwartz07 said 02/14, 04:33 PM
Well lets see, don't compare NFL Europa with the NBA, NFL Europa was a bunch of scrubs that weren't quite "practice squad material" you would be lucky to draw 500 people to one of those games if it were in the US. Yet the NFL games over there have sold out in RECORD TIME.
The NBA wants legit franchises over there, not scrubs. And you say "stretching the talent pool" really? I mean in a sport like baseball or football sure, but basketball? I mean you give a guy like Beasley to one of these teams and there you go, playoff team in the next 3-5 years.
Now your comments on Yao, EXACTLY MY POINT! There are people outside of the US that watch basketball. TONS OF THEM. So why have them watch games on TV at 2 AM while a half empty arena watches in the US?
Like I said even WOMEN'S games are selling out in Europe, so much so that players are threatening to leave and cripple the WNBA (all 6 of their US fans will be upset), if people are willing to see the women, just wait until the guys get there. (no offense to our lady users, just that men's is more popular)
Why deprive people who want the sport? You would be giving up MILLIONS or dollars and Millions of fans.
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Comments (44)
Uh-oh, Shwartz, this will be tough with all of the people on this site that hate change in sports...
DetroitFan* BS: 16-6! | 02/14/08, 03:17 PM
Report Offensive CommentSchwartz*
Error
DetroitFan* BS: 16-6! | 02/14/08, 03:17 PM
Report Offensive CommentI know, I lost one about the Saints and Chargers playing in England, but oh well. I'm bored and if you read this the guy is making my case for me.
BSchwartz07 | 02/14/08, 03:21 PM
Report Offensive Commentyep,theres no reason for teams in europe
Ny - Ready For Change | 02/14/08, 03:22 PM
Report Offensive CommentYes, I actually noticed that. I wanted someone elses opinion before I went on and said it anyway.
DetroitFan* BS: 16-6! | 02/14/08, 03:23 PM
Report Offensive CommentHey, I just finished a TD about this. Schwartzy -the Pro - I wish I would have read your argument before submitting my last one. I would happily have plagerized you. JK. I totally agree and you have my vote.
Thugmeister | 02/14/08, 03:27 PM
Report Offensive Commenthttp://www.fannation.com/throwdowns/show/136478
Thugmeister | 02/14/08, 03:28 PM
Report Offensive CommentAlready saw it Thug, and you had my vote. I was going to comment but then I saw this one and figured I would save up my thoughts for this. jk.
BSchwartz07 | 02/14/08, 03:30 PM
Report Offensive CommentThe myth of Jetlag boggles my mind. Like it will take days and days for recovery when usually a good nights rest does the trick.
Thugmeister | 02/14/08, 03:33 PM
Report Offensive CommentTrue that, i think some european play would expand the viewers to europe and interest more americans too.
Tarheelslyfe123 | 02/14/08, 03:33 PM
Report Offensive CommentThe myth of Jetlag boggles my mind. Like it will take days and days for recovery when usually a good nights rest does the trick.
Thugmeister G BS | 02/14/08, 03:33 PM
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I have had to switch from days to nights 4 times since I got here, not to mention I have been to 4 total countires and all sorts of times zones. You are half tired for a day (nothing a Red Bull can't fix) a good nights sleep and you are fine. Nothing an off day or 2 for travel can't fix
BSchwartz07 | 02/14/08, 03:37 PM
Report Offensive CommentThe hour gap that the Powdered Toast Man alluded to is very pertinent.
I live in Portugal. Live NBA games here start at 1 AM or 2 AM. In Spain and France an hour later. Germany - 2 hours later.
I can only watch live games in the weekends and while on holidays.
Hyped78 | 02/14/08, 03:52 PM
Report Offensive CommentVote to BSchwartz. His second argument is what sway me because that's why I believed this whole thing can work. As long as you schedule the trips appropriately it would not effect the players with jet lag and such.
J. HOVA: BROOKLYN'S OWN | 02/14/08, 03:53 PM
Report Offensive CommentI love it when people will participate in a throwdown and then sit and comentate on the throwdown, IE "he's making my case for me". shut up with that. You put very little thought behind your claims.
Tonight....You | 02/14/08, 03:55 PM
Report Offensive CommentI love it when people will participate in a throwdown and then sit and comentate on the throwdown, IE "he's making my case for me". shut up with that. You put very little thought behind your claims.
Powdered Toast Man | 02/14/08, 03:55 PM
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Do you need a tissue? Don't cry about an argument. You are trying to tell people that the NBA shouldn't move overseas b/c people aren't watching in the US, seems to me like that is making a case TO put teams out there.
I am willing to bet that over half of the people that vote for you don't read a single full argument. "NO GAME OUTSIDE US" all that runs through thier heads before they vote.
BSchwartz07 | 02/14/08, 04:05 PM
Report Offensive CommentAnd in the NBA teams rarely play on back to back nights ---> that isn't true
Hyped78 | 02/14/08, 04:09 PM
Report Offensive CommentAnd in the NBA teams rarely play on back to back nights ---> that isn't true
Hyped78 | 02/14/08, 04:09 PM
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So teams never have 2-3 days without a game? That isn't something that can happen?
BSchwartz07 | 02/14/08, 04:13 PM
Report Offensive Comment#1 BSchwartz07: yes, it can. But that's not what you wrote. You wrote "... teams rarely play on back to back nights". If you go to NBA.COM and check out the schedule, you'll see the amount of back to back games that the NBA has.
Hyped78 | 02/14/08, 04:19 PM
Report Offensive CommentIt's bound to happen sooner or later anyway. It is probably going to be a financial boon, and the NBA has a very strong European following. Stern has yet to make a wrong decision in my mind, I see no reason for him to fail here either.
Favrefan misses Hawaii | 02/14/08, 04:23 PM
Report Offensive Comment#1 BSchwartz07: yes, it can. But that's not what you wrote. You wrote "... teams rarely play on back to back nights". If you go to NBA.COM and check out the schedule, you'll see the amount of back to back games that the NBA has.
Hyped78 | 02/14/08, 04:19 PM
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My bad Hyped, I actually wrote "back to back to back", but I write in word to correct spelling mistakes and it removed one. Should have just put 3 straight nights to clear this up. MY BAD
BSchwartz07 | 02/14/08, 04:25 PM
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