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- April 15, 2008 08:36 PM ET
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All AFC West - Offense
Sully. said 04/15, 08:36 PM
Make an offensive roster of current AFC West players. (Free agents that have signed this offseason count, but guys that are now with teams out of the division do not.)
You must have at least two differences. I'm sick of coming up with a full list only to have somebody tweak one single player and win because of just that and leeching off of my other picks. Thanks, it makes it more fun to debate other positions too.
QB: Philip Rivers (SD)
RB: LaDainian Tomlinson (SD)
RB: Larry Johnson (KC)
TE: Tony Gonzalez (KC)
WR: Dwayne Bowe (KC)
WR: Chris Chambers (SD)
WR: Brandon Marshall (DEN)
The Bandit said 04/15, 08:53 PM
Alright, here's mine.
QB: Jay Cutler (Broncos) **
RB: LT (Chargers)
RB: Larry Johnson (Chiefs)
TE; Antonio Gates ( Chargers) **
WR: Brandon Marshall ( Broncos)
WR: Dwayne Bowe ( Chiefs)
WR: Brandon Stokely (Broncos) ** more versatile, better Y.A.C., and 80 more yards total than Chambers on only 5 more rec.
Sully. said 04/15, 09:54 PM
Rivers vs. Cutler
Honestly, stats wise this one is a toss up. Both guys had a good season last year , but I won't compare career stats since Rivers has been in the league two years more. I chose Rivers because he has the post season success, getting his team to the AFC Championship last year. Not to mention a solid Pro Bowl season the year before, his first as a starter.
Gates vs. Gonzo
Gonzo had 99 catches, 1,172 yards, and 5 touchdowns.
Gates had 75 catches, 984 yards, and 9 touchdowns.
Gates beats him in touchdowns, but that's about it. Gonzo was also on a terrible team, and his stats over the past few years have been much more consistent. I'll get to that later.
Chambers vs. Stokley
Chambers had 66 catches, 970 yards, and 4 touchdowns.
Stokley had 40 catches, 635 yards, and 5 touchdowns.
I think you must have been looking at only Chambers' stats when he was with San Diego. But Chambers put up better stats in nearly every category, and this is a guy who started off the season playing 6 games for the worst team in the NFL.
Not to mention in the past two seasons, Stokley has played 17 games total. Chambers hasn't missed a game during that timespan.
The Bandit said 04/15, 10:20 PM
You were right, i was only looking at Chamber's stats for SD, but even with that factored in, Stokely is a more eficient wideout due to the fact that he averages more yards per catch avg. and also does more with the ball after the reception. Proof: Stokely gains 3.2 yards more after catch while Chambers only just under 2.6.
Also, when you factor in his stats while with Miami, CC has less YPC avg than BS. (15.9 to 14.7). BS has more 1 more TD in 3 less games. CC has fumbled once, BS none. BS is the more efficient WR, Chambers has has the longevity edge.
Now, Gates vs. Gonzo.
AG: 75 rec, 984 yds, 61.5 y/g. 13.1 yprec avg., 4.2 YAC, 9 TD's
TG: 99 rec, 1172, 73.3 y/g, 11.8 yprec avg., 3.2 YAC, 5 TD's
Gonzo has more total rec yards but only because he has 24 more catches. Gates is the better playmaker as he avg's more YPC(13 to 11.8). Also, Gates does more with the ball after the catch as he outgains Gonzo by a full yard. That could mean the difference between gaining a 1st down or being at 4th down and 1.
Gates also has a better nose for the end zone as he has piled up 9 TD's to Gonzo's 5. despite sharing the offensive load with LT, he's made impact.
QB's next.
Sully. said 04/15, 10:42 PM
But Stokley can't be more efficeint if he isn't on the field. He's too injury prone to make a big impact over the long run. In his entire career, he averages 9 games played a year. Nine! I don't want a human injury walking around on my team, I want somebody who I know will be ready to play hard, which Chambers gives me. In 7 years, Chambers has missed only 2 games total.
Gates also has more touchdowns because he was on a much, much better offense and he got far more looks inside the 20s.
The Chiefs were 31st in points scored and 31st in total yards. Terrible.
The Chargers were 5th in points scored and 20th in total yards.
Not to mention, Phillip Rivers was much better than Huard/Croyle. Considering all of those factors, and Gonzalez still has almost identical stats, with all of those things to overcome? I'll take Tony.
On to Rivers vs. Cutler. Rivers has already been to a Pro Bowl and led his team to the AFC Championship, on a bad knee nonetheless. Cutler hasn't even sniffed the playoffs yet.
In the playoffs, Rivers has thrown for 997 yards and an average passer rating of 81.85. Now that's pretty solid, and to put a guy with zero playoff experience in his place isn't right.
The Bandit said 04/15, 11:15 PM
So if you state that gates was on a much better offense, so wouldn't that mean I would have the edge?
This TD is about an all the best AFC West Offense, and since Gates plays on a better team, then you would have to take him over Gonzo. It's neither each player's fault that they are on such teams. you can't make that as an excuse.
Gonzo, despite being ona terrible team like you stated, has been one of the main, if not the only bright spot, in KC;s offense with LJ out. With that said, shouldn't he have more prolific stats than Gates as far as TD's. But it's not the case. Gates has more 4 more TD's(9 to Gonzo's 5) and has better yards per catch avg. despite sharing the load with LT and a better WR core than that of the Chiefs.
Cutler vs. Rivers.
QB rate: JC 88.1%, PR 82.4 %
Comp %: JC 63.6, PR 60
Pass Yds: JC 3497, PR 3152
Y/G avg.: JC 218, PR 197
TD's: JC 20, PR 21
Int's: JC 14, PR 15
As you can see, Cutler is the more prolific passer as he surpasses Rivers in almost all passing category. Rivers may have 1 more TD, but he also has one more INT. JC is more efficient as he completes more of his passes and actually gets more yards per att7.5 yds to River's 6).
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Comments (22) Add A Comment
GL Sully.
The Bandit
Somewhere, CO
Total Comments (1140)
Sully Sully Sully, Picking the p.u.s.s.y over Cutler. and Bandit, I'm LOVIN the Stokely pick. LOVIN IT
ROYALwCHEESE BS CB…
Near Cleveland, OH
Total Comments (1753)
Thanks Lynch.
The Bandit
Somewhere, CO
Total Comments (1140)
I saw one of these the other day that had Fargas as RB and no LJ. I thought that was quite funny. This one has a clear winner in my eyes, but I'll wait to vote.
Spinnerbait
Tidewater, VA
Total Comments (91)
Thanks Bandit, good luck to you too.
Sully.
Total Comments (220)
Sully Sully Sully, Picking the p.u.s.s.y over Cutler. and Bandit, I'm LOVIN the Stokely pick. LOVIN IT
LYNCHisOTGY* BS MS | 04/15/08, 09:05 PM
Well, I'm not a fan of Rivers attitude either, but he is a solid player. What he did in the playoffs with that bad knee took some balls.
Sully.
Total Comments (220)
Well, I'm not a fan of Rivers attitude either, but he is a solid player. What he did in the playoffs with that bad knee took some balls.
Sully* | 04/15/08, 09:54 PM
Report Offensive Comment
Cutler hasn't sniffed what Rivers has done, and there isn't anyone here who is bothered more by Rivers than I am. No offense, Broncos fans, but let's wait until Cutler has actually achieved something before throwing him into comparisons against QBs who have.
"My dad says you suck right now, but some day you COULD be really good!"
-Stan Marsh to Jay Cutler
Steelercooz
St. Paul, MN
Total Comments (3669)
Sorry, when I meant longevity edge, i meant Chambers has started in more games.
The Bandit
Somewhere, CO
Total Comments (1140)
My point with comparing the offenses was to show that Gonzalez was just about the only weapon on his, while Gates had a lot of help. Gates had the better offensive line to give his better quarterback more time, and a better runningback to take pressure off that passing game. And even with Bowe on the Chiefs, Gates had the better receiving core so defenses couldn't focus solely on him.
And with the Cutler vs. Rivers argument, you only compared this year, where Rivers and everybody else on that offense had to struggle with a new head coach. If you look at Rivers last season, he blows Cutler out of the water.
Good throwdown.
Sully.
Total Comments (220)
Aw yes the weak QB division.
c note
Total Comments (1892)
I like Rivers over Cutler because he has more weapons. Gates over Gonzalez who unfortunately can't throw the ball to himself. It comes down to WR and I'd take Chambers because of Stokley's injury history.
Vote left
c note
Total Comments (1892)
I ahte Rivers. What how does Rivers have more weapons? Gates and LT and who else? Jay Cutler has a very solid WR with Marshall and Stokley.
Chengy: bye FN
Ashland , OH
Total Comments (8281)
Marshall's injury worries me and Rivers does have Chambers and Craig Davis from last year.
c note
Total Comments (1892)
Another reason why I took Cutler was that he is a better rusher. He is more mobile in the pocket, and can scramble out of dangerous situations. Cutler has 205 rush yards to River's 33.
The Bandit
Somewhere, CO
Total Comments (1140)
And with the Cutler vs. Rivers argument, you only compared this year, where Rivers and everybody else on that offense had to struggle with a new head coach. If you look at Rivers last season, he blows Cutler out of the water.
Good throwdown.
Sully* | 04/15/08, 11:23 PM
Sully, if you're talking about 2006 season where you say Rivers blows Cutler out of the water, you gotta understand that was Cutler's rookie year where he only started 5 games after replacing Plummer. ONLY 5 games!! so you can't expect much. Rivers was already in his 4th year, and started all 16 games in '06. Of course he'll blow Cutler out of the water. You have to give Cutler a break at that time, he was still learning Shanahan's sytem.
The Bandit
Somewhere, CO
Total Comments (1140)
Yeah, that came out wrong. I didn't mean to compare Rivers' season directly to Cutler's that year. I meant that you can't ignore the best season Rivers has had only a year ago, because if you put the two together his stats are pretty impressive for a guy who's only started two years.
Sully.
Total Comments (220)
Yeah, I'll admit Rivers did have a good first full year. But Cutler's first full season isn't chopped liver. Their QB ratings for their 1st full year are pretty close, 88 to 92. Cutler does bring a little more to the table because he is a better scrambler, and with that aspect of the game, can rush for the necessary 1st down.
The Bandit
Somewhere, CO
Total Comments (1140)
Rivers was injured all year why does no one ever bring that up
Kendrick fan#1
Buena Park , CA
Total Comments (227)
whats going to be funny is in 2 yrs when lt and gates are old for their positions and sd goes back to being sd, rivers is going to suck it up and all that trash talkin is going to bite him
Frank Pentangelli
Total Comments (3905)
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djroxalot
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