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  • 08/28/2011, 07:52PM ET

NL Cy Young Winner

MorningWoodley (8-12-0) vs Rudedog: Believe The Hype (370-317-81)
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Clayton Kershaw is going to win the NL Cy Young Award this year. He has the 2nd most wins in the NL with 16, 3rd in ERA with 2.51, 1st in K's with 207 and 2nd in WHIP with 1.02. Put all these stats together and he is obviously the best candidate for the NL Cy Young Award!


Solid argument, but I can one up you

2.05 ERA, 1.06 WHIP, 5.81 K/9, .203 BAA

My pick, like most of you know will be, is Johnny Cueto

Cueto, for whatever reason, is getting no Cy Young love, which is silly. The main reasoning for this is his low inning count. This isn't due to him leaving games early all the time or missing starts. It's due to him missing a month at the beginning of the season. Since then, he's missed 1 start and that was just delayed one day.

In fact, Cueto averages 6.6 innings a start. In comparison, 7.0 innings. While it's more, it's not a significant amount and shows you that Cueto does pitch his fair share of innings. 4 times this year he's pitched at least 8 innings and only once has he pitched less than 5 innings.

The other knock against him is his 9-5 record. While this doesn't make sense to me, he's still had plenty of opportunities for wins. 7 times this year, Cueto has received a no-decision. Despite that, the Reds are 14-7 in games he pitches in, which is a far more accurate number for his pitching efforts this year.

MMTC


In the last 20 years no starter that has won the CY Young Award has had less than 15 wins, Cueto has 9 going into the last month of the season. Also each has had atleast 200 innings pitched which Cueto will also not have. Also, Cueto's ERA should be lower than Kershaw's because he's played less games. Kershaw's WHIP is lower than Cueto's by .04 and while Cueto's K/9 is 5.81 Kershaws is somewhere in the 9.8 region, which is a lot higher and more impressive than Cueto. Anyone that knows baseball knows the Kershaw will win the Cy Young award and Cueto won't even get a consideration.


Back to back great arguments. Try the enter button

Now, the innings pitched issue is a unique one, I'll give you that. And while Cueto will finish with less than 200 innings pitched, that shouldn't be the reason to not give him the Cy Young.

Cueto has pitched in 21 games this year. It'll end up being about 3 to 4 games less than the norm. In the end, are we really looking at that big of a difference? It's just silly to me to not include Cueto in the discussion because he was injured. That's it. That's the problem.

Cueto has maintained his level of dominance the entire season. It's not like he's on a hot streak that will eventually wear off. No. He's having a great season and deserves to be awarded as such.

1998 was the last time someone outside of the top 2 of the lowest ERA won the Cy Young. Right now, minus Cueto imploding, he'll finish with the best ERA. That's already a big leg up in the competition.

And the strikeout argument is stupid. You're telling me that a 1 pitch groundout is worse than a 3-pitch minimum strikeout? That's stupid. Strikeouts are one stat that shows good pitchers, but pitchers can be good while not striking opponents out


Kershaw also plays for a worse team, so he doesn't get as much run support and yet he still has a way better than Cueto. Cueto has a very good hitting line up to back him up with Votto, Bruce, and Phillips. The Dodgers have Kemp and thats it. This makes Kershaw's W/L record that much more impressive. Your argument is irrelevant because Cueto will not even get acknowledged has a Cy Young candidate because of his low inning count, low strikeout numbers, and not many wins and a decent amount of losses. He has one less loss than Kershaw and Kershaw has 7 more wins and plays for a much worse team. I don't see how this is even an argument. You might have a chance if you argued someone like halladay hamels, lee, o lincicum but now Cueto at all


Cueto might have a solid hitting lineup, but they have been massively inconsistent and he hasn't had nearly the run support this year.

In 10 of his 20 starts starts this year, the Reds have scored 3 or less runs. Cueto's run support numbers are skewed because there have been a couple games the Reds have put up big numbers offensively.

If you honestly think Cueto won't even get acknowledged for Cy Young, turn in your sports fan card. It's one thing when people say he won't win it, and that's debatable, but to say no one will acknowledge him? HE'S THE ERA LEADER IN THE MLB. You're not even gonna consider him for the award?

You're ignorance and arrogance for this is silly. You're either a Dodgers fan or just not smart enough to realize what it takes to win the Cy Young. I'm not saying Kershaw isn't a worthy candidate, but the argument you make for him isn't a good one. You're just repeating that he has a low ERA, more innings that Cueto, etc.

Cueto has been dominant all year and has proven he's the best pitcher this year. He deserves the Cy Young.

August 28, 2011  08:32 PM ET

Hamels

August 28, 2011  11:04 PM ET

Roy Halladay.

August 28, 2011  11:12 PM ET
QUOTE(#2):

Roy Halladay.

That would have been my pick. Rude is going to have a tough time overcoming the 50 innings-pitched deficit Cueto has relative to Kershaw.

August 28, 2011  11:34 PM ET

Craig Kimbrel.

August 29, 2011  12:37 AM ET
QUOTE(#2):

Roy Halladay.

Agreed. But the Moth game will hurt him in the voting.

Comment #6 has been removed
August 29, 2011  07:19 AM ET
QUOTE(#6):

Cueto doesn't strike anybody out.He's had a fantastic season, but he only has 86 K's. Kershaw has 207.The Cy Young voters will notice that Kershaw has 121 more K's than Cueto.

To me that's not a good reason.

A groundout works just the same as a strikeout, and it can save the pitch count.

August 29, 2011  10:26 AM ET
QUOTE(#6):

Cueto doesn't strike anybody out.He's had a fantastic season, but he only has 86 K's. Kershaw has 207.The Cy Young voters will notice that Kershaw has 121 more K's than Cueto.

So getting a 1 pitch ground is worse than a 3 pitch strikeout?

August 29, 2011  01:54 PM ET
QUOTE(#8):

So getting a 1 pitch ground is worse than a 3 pitch strikeout?

You really need to stop stumping for Cueto to win the Cy Young.

He's got 140 innings and will probably start another five games. He's averaging about 6.2 innings per start, so he'll probably finish with about 175 innings on the season. Even if he threw complete games from here on out, he'd finish the season with 185 innings, well short of what it would take to win a Cy Young.

Over the last ten years, the average IP for SPs winning the Cy Young is 235 - 34% more innings that Cueto will likely pitch. Only one starter, Clemens in '04, won the CY with less than 220 IP, and he had 214.

Cueto might have enough innings to qualify for the ERA title, but he'll be lucky to finish in the top five in Cy Young voting. Kershaw, Lincecum, Halladay, Hamels and Lee will all finish above him.

Cueto is not going to win the Cy Young this year and the more you petition for it, the more you seem like a ridiculous homer.

August 29, 2011  01:55 PM ET
QUOTE(#8):

So getting a 1 pitch ground is worse than a 3 pitch strikeout?

Sometimes, yes.

August 29, 2011  01:57 PM ET
QUOTE(#7):

A groundout works just the same as a strikeout

Not always.

Man on third, groundout to short stop for a 4-3 putout but the man on third scores. A K would have been better.

August 29, 2011  02:02 PM ET
QUOTE(#11):

Not always.Man on third, groundout to short stop for a 4-3 putout but the man on third scores. A K would have been better.

Not if the infield is in, and they either get the runner out at home, which is better than a strikeout, or the SS looks the runner back, and gets the out at first, then it's just the same.

An infield popout always works the same as a strikeout. I love strikeouts, but I also like a good sinker ball pitcher that can get a lot of groundouts, which leads to a lot of double plays.

August 29, 2011  02:13 PM ET

Wins?

Wow.

August 29, 2011  02:15 PM ET
QUOTE(#13):

Wins?Wow.

They still matter to Cy Young voters. They aren't as important as they used to be, but they are still looked at.

August 29, 2011  02:19 PM ET
QUOTE(#12):

Not if the infield is in, and they either get the runner out at home, which is better than a strikeout, or the SS looks the runner back, and gets the out at first, then it's just the same.An infield popout always works the same as a strikeout. I love strikeouts, but I also like a good sinker ball pitcher that can get a lot of groundouts, which leads to a lot of double plays.

No doubt, but the idea that a groundout is the same as a strikeout -- which is what you said -- is not true.

Further, how many would-be groundouts turn into errors, or aren't stopped at all? I like groundball pitchers as well, but if I had my choice between two pitchers, one a K artist and the other a groundballer, all other things being equal, I'll take the K's everytime.

August 29, 2011  02:20 PM ET
QUOTE(#13):

Wins?Wow.

Were you really Roy?

August 29, 2011  02:23 PM ET
QUOTE(#15):

No doubt, but the idea that a groundout is the same as a strikeout -- which is what you said -- is not true.Further, how many would-be groundouts turn into errors, or aren't stopped at all? I like groundball pitchers as well, but if I had my choice between two pitchers, one a K artist and the other a groundballer, all other things being equal, I'll take the K's everytime.

With the bases empty, or with two outs, an outfielder robbing a home run works just the same as a strikeout.

I would probably take the strikeout pitcher as well, but I'd take a lot of sinker ballers like Tim Hudson over a lot of strikeout pitchers like Javier Vazquez.

August 29, 2011  02:24 PM ET
QUOTE(#9):

You really need to stop stumping for Cueto to win the Cy Young.He's got 140 innings and will probably start another five games. He's averaging about 6.2 innings per start, so he'll probably finish with about 175 innings on the season. Even if he threw complete games from here on out, he'd finish the season with 185 innings, well short of what it would take to win a Cy Young.Over the last ten years, the average IP for SPs winning the Cy Young is 235 - 34% more innings that Cueto will likely pitch. Only one starter, Clemens in '04, won the CY with less than 220 IP, and he had 214.Cueto might have enough innings to qualify for the ERA title, but he'll be lucky to finish in the top five in Cy Young voting. Kershaw, Lincecum, Halladay, Hamels and Lee will all finish above him.Cueto is not going to win the Cy Young this year and the more you petition for it, the more you seem like a ridiculous homer.

I agree. Buchholz had the same issue last year and I was against him being in the Cy Young conversation. 175-185 innings is not enough when there are guys topping 230 with similar numbers.

August 29, 2011  02:25 PM ET
QUOTE(#15):

No doubt, but the idea that a groundout is the same as a strikeout -- which is what you said -- is not true.Further, how many would-be groundouts turn into errors, or aren't stopped at all? I like groundball pitchers as well, but if I had my choice between two pitchers, one a K artist and the other a groundballer, all other things being equal, I'll take the K's everytime.

A strikeout isn't moving a runner from 2nd to 3rd with no outs where a groundout might and let him score without anyone getting a hit.

 
August 29, 2011  02:28 PM ET
QUOTE(#17):

With the bases empty, or with two outs, an outfielder robbing a home run works just the same as a strikeout.I would probably take the strikeout pitcher as well, but I'd take a lot of sinker ballers like Tim Hudson over a lot of strikeout pitchers like Javier Vazquez.

Javier Vazquez was a stink out pitcher.

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