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  • 03/19/2012, 09:59PM ET

Rubio or Wall?

ANFERNEE!!!!! (25-22-3) vs DJRoxalot (1085-669-126)
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If you were an NBA GM, which point guard would you want on your team?

Being a T-wolves fan, it was tough news hearing of Rubio's injury recently. He has been a great contribution to the team. With that said, I think he is overrated. Yes, he is a good passer, but as teams started to figure out how to stop him his production steadily worsened.

Rubio's monthly stats:

January- 12.0 PTS, 9.1 AST, 4.7 REB, 2.4 STL, 3.3 TO, 36.6 FG%, 82.4 FT%
February- 10.0 PTS, 7.7 AST, 3.7 REB, 2.4 STL, 3.3 TO, 33.6 FG%, 78.8 FT%
March- 9.2 PTS, 6.8 AST, 3.2 REB, 1.6 STL, 2.6 TO, 31.0 FG%, 78.3 FT%

As you can see, Rubio's stats gradually decline. His FG% was horrid to begin with, and it still declined each month. Same with his PTS, AST, REB, STL, and FT%.

Wall, on the other hand, has improved over the course of the season.

January- 16.6 PTS, 7.3 AST, 5.5 REB, 1.1 STL, 4.1 TO, 41.4 FG%, 81.9 FT%
February- 19.2 PTS, 8.6 AST, 4.6 REB, 1.4 STL, 4.1 TO, 48.0 FG%, 81.6 FT%
March- 18.7 PTS, 8.7 AST, 4.3 REB, 1.4 STL, 3.8 TO, 49.6 FG%, 72.4 FT%

Wall is the more well rounded PG and he improves as the season progresses. I'd take him.


Now, let me show you the numbers of a rookie that has turned into a HOF caliber PG:

11.7ppg, 7.7apg, 5.4rpg, and 1.9spg while shooting 38.5% on FG's, 27.2% on 3-pointers, and 69.8% on FT's.

Rubio, 10.6ppg, 8.2apg, 4.2rpg, and 2.2spg while shooting 35.7%, 34%, and 80.3%.

Now, I am not saying Rubio is going to be a HOF'er, but he can certainly get better at shooting. Like.........Jason Kidd has.

Rubio was 5th in apg and 3rd in spg when he went down with his injury. He was a huge reason the Timberwolves were fighting for a playoff spot.

The Wolves are 1-4 since Rubio's injury? Coincidence? No, I think they really miss the kid.

Rubio can make a difference in a game when he isn't scoring. That can't be said for all PG's. He plays defense, passes, and rebounds the ball very well. His shooting was expected to be his weakness. It will be something he obviously has to work on in order to be a better all around player.

As far as his declining stats? That happens to most rookies as they hit the "rookie wall" and have to get used to playing a longer season.


Shooting was expected to be the weakness for both Rubio and Wall, and it is. Despite the shooting woes, Wall still manages average 44.3% from the field. If he develops a consistent jump shot, he will be a very dangerous player than can do nearly anything on the court.

Lets compare Derrick Rose with Wall:

Rose's first 2 seasons:
16.8 ppg, 6.3 apg, 3.9 rpg, 1.5 spg, 47.5 FG%
20.8 ppg, 6.0 apg, 3.7 rpg, 1.2 spg, 48.9 FG%

Walls first 2 seasons:
16.4 ppg, 8.3 apg, 4.6 rpg, 1.8 spg, 40.9FG%
17.6 ppg, 7.9 apg, 4.8 rpg, 1.3 spg, 44.3 FG%

Rose and Wall have very similar playing styles and skill sets, so there is no reason to doubt that Wall could match Rose's production and success. He just needs the teammates to help him do it. Teammates like Rose and Rubio have.

While Rubio may be 5th in apg, and 3rd in spg.. he has the lowest FG% amongst qualified rookies. And while he does not make the list of qualified NBA players for FG%, the lowest rating is 37%... which is 1.3% more than Rubio's.

Rubio is a good player that is fun to watch, but if he cannot improve his scoring ability he will not be a great PG. Wall, however, can already score... and pass... and rebound.


John Wall is in his 2nd NBA season. Rubio was an NBA rookie.

I would hope Wall would increase his FG % to 44.3 since he doesn't shoot many 3-pointers. 23 this season, or 1 every other game. Wall's game is to drive and penetrate (similar to Rose) and Rubio is more of a perimeter player. He plays on the outside and looks to pass first.

Rubio is a better defender than Wall. He has the wingspan of a player that is 6-9 and he will be a player that is a pesky guy for players to try and score against. He has better court vision than Wall and is just as good a rebounder.

You bring up that Rubio has better talent?

Washington had some talent also. Nick Young. All he does is score, but he did that well in Washington to the tune of 16.4ppg. Jordan Crawford averages 13.3ppg. And Javele McGee was a solid low post player that averaged nearly 12ppg. The Wizards primary problem was that they had too many bad personalities in the locker room and were (are) underperforming.

Usually, a sign of of players giving up on the coach. That's why the coach was fired and Randy Wittman replaced him.


Yes, Crawford and Young can score, but they do it while shooting 39% and 40% respectively. If they raise their FG% to 45% like Beasley, Williams, and Love, then Wall's assists will increase.

Rubio is a good defender, but so is Wall. Rubio may have a 6-9 wingspan... but Wall's is 6-9.25

Hollinger Stats (http://tinyurl.com/6su523x) are useful when comparing the 2 players.
TS%, AST, TO, USG, REB, PER, VA, EWA
Rubio .476 36.3 14.2 19.6 6.7 14.84 80.5 2.7
Wall .522 27.4 14.1 25.0 7.3 18.82 190.0 6.3

Explanation for each stat can be found by clicking the above link.

More possessions of Rubio's end in assists, but he also does have better players that shoot a higher %. The league PER average every year is 15.0. Rubio is below that. Wall is sitting nearly 4 points above it. Value added is another key stat to examine. Wall is 26th in the league in this category, right above Duncan and Irving. Rubio is 97th, right above Trevor Ariza.

Est. wins added... Wall more than doubles Rubio and ranks 28th in the NBA, right above Duncan (again). Rubio is sitting with some great players too. He is tied for 92nd.. with Redick and Farmar.


"Yes, Crawford and Young can score, but they do it while shooting 39% and 40% respectively. If they raise their FG% to 45% like Beasley, Williams, and Love, then Wall's assists will increase."

Listen, Wall has more talent than people are giving him credit for. Crawford and Young are scorers, not shooters. There is a difference. And they can definitely score. He also had McGee for most of the season and he's a pretty solid option at center.

And sure, Rubio has Love, but Washington has some talent as well.

Rubio can make a difference without scoring too much. On Jan 16th, he had just 9 points, but he dished out 8 assists, grabbed 8 rebounds, and snatched 2 steals in a 99-86 win.

"More possessions of Rubio's end in assists, but he also does have better players that shoot a higher %."

The Wizards make 43.7% of their FG's.

The Wolves make 43.6% so your numbers are actually off.

Wall had a 1.9 assist to TO ratio. As opposed to Rubio's 2.6 ratio. Rubio is a better passer and more careful with the ball.

March 19, 2012  10:17 PM ET

If i knew the future of Rubio's knee i would take him over Wall and not even really have a tough time coming to that conclusion

March 19, 2012  10:43 PM ET

How many NBA players lasted in the league when they shot 35% from the field? Not many. Other than Rondo, I don't think there is a similar NBA player out there. The only difference is that Rondo has a FG% of 46% compared to Rubio's 35.7%.

If Rubio wants to continue playing in the NBA while shooting 36% from the field, he is going to have to become the best passer in the league.

Comment #3 has been removed
March 19, 2012  11:25 PM ET

Jason Kidd shot 38% his first 4 seasons, and is a career 40% shooter. This is Rubio's first year playing the game in this country. He's fg% will improve, maybe not drastically; but it doesn't have to. John Wall looks lost at times to me, like a guy who is playing ball simply because he is athletic. While Rubio may not have his athleticism his basketball IQ is off the charts. Its not like Wall is a great shooter anyway, at least Rubio can hit an open 3. Gasol and Bosh have more 3s then Wall and shoot at a higher %.

Comment #5 has been removed
March 19, 2012  11:43 PM ET

The Timberwolves without Rubio are faltering badly.

March 19, 2012  11:54 PM ET

Wall shoots an average of .5 three pointers a game..... that is 262nd in the league. He doesn't have a high 3pt FG%, so he doesn't shoot 3 pointers. The fact that he can still average 19 points and shoot 49% from the field over the last 2 months WITHOUT A JUMPSHOT, says a lot about his potential.

Post all star break averages:

Wall- 20 PTS, 8.8 AST, 4.3 REB, 49.1 FG% (5th highest efficiency per game rating amongst Guards... tied with Kobe)

Rubio- 7.3 PTS, 7.4 AST, 3.7 REB, 25.9 FG% (54th highest efficiency per game rating amongst Guards.... right below Ramon Sessions)

You say you like Rubio because he can hit the open 3. Well then I like Wall because he can make a layup.

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March 20, 2012  12:05 AM ET
QUOTE(#6):

The Timberwolves without Rubio are faltering badly.

Losing Rubio was a big loss to the team, there is no doubt about that. The past few games they have had to change their playing style, and it is difficult to win when doing this. Other players need to step up, and nobody other than Love has. (Love is averaging 29.7 pts and 13.1 reb a game in March).

I think once they figure out how to play with them they will start to win more games. I don't think they will be as good of a team, but with Love and the emerging Pekovic they have a shot at winning any game.

Comment #12 has been removed
March 20, 2012  01:31 AM ET
QUOTE(#12):

Rubio has the better talent on his team. So, there's no big surprise that he has more assists. However, Wall looks lost, like he's sleep walking on the court sometimes. Is he bored or just disgusted with all the losing? It's hard to really say. Had Rubio not sustained this injury, I would'nt need more than 30 seconds to pick him over Wall. But, ACL injuries are serious and that gives me reason to pause.

Wall will have more than 8.2 apg (Rubios apg) when the season ends, and he is playing with far inferior players. With the absence of Rubio, Ridnour has been averaging 9.2 apg and 13 ppg...

March 20, 2012  01:32 AM ET
QUOTE(#9):

Wall's also been in the NBA how long? Compared to Rubio?

Rubio has been playing professional basketball how long? Compared to Wall?

March 20, 2012  01:49 AM ET

Wall reminds me of Starzberry, while Rubio compliments his teammates way better in a shorter period of time.

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March 20, 2012  10:58 AM ET

Comment #18 has been removed
March 20, 2012  11:35 AM ET
QUOTE(#18):

Hey, hey!!! Make sure you point out ColoradoBanger. He voted left, Canuck.

Don't be a hypocrite.

ColoradoBanger has pages and pages of comments. I only point out "members" that have 0 -10 comments and have been on the site for years and newbies that magically find your throwdowns. You know like dupe accounts.

 
Comment #20 has been removed

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