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  • 04/12/2012, 02:26AM ET

Should the baseball Hall of Fame ban PED users?

Marlins Fan (156-78-31) vs DonCorleone (34-10-4)
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At one point I was so against PED users entering the Hall that I was not capable of having an open-minded discussion about this topic. I have no doubt that many others are still in that same boat. But time has changed me and my opinions. I'm not so against PED users entering the Hall anymore. Here's why:

For one thing, a lot of the backlash came from MLB's fraternity; a close-knit group that likes inventing bizarre and obscure unwritten rules. Many of these rules come from former players; some come from the media. For example, the BBWAA thinks it's appropriate to keep Hall-worthy players out for certain amounts of time. There are many example of players whose numbers warrant incusion being left out for a year or two simply because the BBWAA doesn't deem them a "first ballot" player.

This unwritten rule business is garbage. Either it's a rule or it's not. And in this case, there is no existing ban on PED users entering the Hall. Maybe an unwritten ban but that's a load of crap.

Look, we'll never identify all users. Some guys would've qualified even without PEDs. We might as well accept the steroid era for what it was.

The Hall should NOT ban PED users.


Long time no TD, bro.

I will have to pick the side of banning PED users.

The main reason why I believe they should be banned is because they cheated. These players cheated by taking performance enhancers to gain an edge on the playing field, which diminishes the purity (yes, I said it) of our beloved game.

I also want to point out that there's no way we can know if players like Bonds, Clemens, McGwire, Sosa, A-Rod, etc. took PEDs for a short time, or for a more extended time then what is speculated. For this reason, I avoid the talk of "well, so and so would have made it in to the hall with or without PEDs." Then why take them in the first place?

Cheaters shouldn't be awarded the highest of honor bestowed upon baseball players. What kind if example would this be to the youth if repeat cheaters that abused drugs are honored?

It's less about the "purity" of the game, and more about integrity and character. Clemens, Palmeiro, A-Rod, etc. have not only cheated, but lied constantly about taking drugs.



Records were broken, and an unfair advantage on the field was gained by PED users. No honor in that.


You're right; it's been a while.

It's true that PED users cheated. But so did spitball pitchers. But nobody's suggesting that the Hall of Fame ban spitballers. The lack of a ban on spitballers established a precedent that the Hall is not going to issue a ban on cheaters. Some may argue that using PEDs is a worse offense than doctoring a ball before throwing a pitch, but that's just conjecture and even if those people have some credibility they're still just splitting hairs.

This is why I believe that the Hall should simply continue what they've already been doing; in other words, refraining from implementing a ban on PED users. There is no precedent and such a ban would be nearly impossible to thoroughly enforce anyway.

Many suspected PED users have never been outright busted. What would the Hall do with guys like that?

We certainly can't allow the Hall to go on a witch hunt and ban players they think used PEDs. And we can't punish an entire generation for the sins of their peers.

Any ban would be imperfect, at best. The Hall of Fame is much better off leaving the status quo untouched. Voters can pick and choose whom they feel are eligible.



GL


Gaylord Perry was inducted to the Hall in 1991, even though he admitted (and wrote a book) about utilize the spitball. Now, here is the guideline that the BWAA states for voters to use:

Voting shall be based upon the player???s record, playing ability, integrity, sportsmanship, character, and contributions to the team(s) on which the player played.

Clearly, the voters in 1991 missed this guideline, and I don't agree with Perry's induction. This is a whole other topic, but I'm just going to say that we can't make the excuse that PED users should be allowed in because a spitball pitcher is in.

There isn't an official ban, but judging from the votes Big Mac and Palmeiro have been receiving, it doesn't look good for the steroid guys. I don't want to punish the entire generation, and it's not like I dislike these guys at all. But MLB has to make an example out of PED users.

It just wouldn't look right to see any one of them in Cooperstown at the induction ceremony. It's also funny that none have really shown a lot of remorse for what they did, except maybe Giambi.

From the BWAA guideline, the PED users missed on character, sportsmanship, and integrity.


MLB has a system already in place for dealing with PED users. There's a 50-game ban for first time offenders; 100 games for a second offense; and the grand-daddy of them all - a lifetime ban for third time offenders. All suspensions are without pay.

The Hall of Fame doesn't have a ban in place and they don't need to because MLB already disciplines cheaters. Double jeopardy, and whatnot.

And as I've said before, MLB players have always cheated. The biggest names from baseball lore were guilty - guys like Hank Aaron and Willie Mays used amphetamines in the 60's. In 1970 a man named Jim Bouton wrote a tell-all book called "Ball Four", in which he described the prevalence of little green speed pills known as "greenies" or "beans".

Now to be sure, greenies weren't banned by MLB back then. But they were illegal, per the federal government. Just like steroids, which weren't banned by MLB until 2002 but were federally banned all along.

Fair is fair, and that means the Hall of Fame shouldn't use a different set of rules for the "Steroid Era" players than they did for those all-time greats like Aaron and Mays.

The Hall of Fame should not ban PED users.


So, are you saying that so long a player doesn't cheat more then two times, which wouldn't incur the "lifetime ban," that you'd still be ok with a PED user getting into the Hall of Fame today?

I'm trying to make a statement that if a player cheats by using PEDs, he cannot get in, because induction is more then just stats. Like I said before, character, integrity, and sportsmanship are compromised.

Amphetamines is not the same as steroids and HGH, not even close. "Greenies" basically keeps you up and focused (kinda like Red Bulls and coffee), though more potent. This shouldn't be compared to growth hormone drugs.

I don't understand why people bring up the issue that past players should be banned and taken out of the hall, if it is agreed PED users in the 90's-present are banned. Just because some guys got in doesn't mean the Hall of Fame should be a revolving door for more cheaters to get in.

Allowing PED users in will tell the youth and fans that it is ok to crush records like Aaron's homerun record by using drugs to enhance themselves physically.

Immortalizing these guys in the Hall of Fame is not a good idea.

No-go for the Hall.

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April 12, 2012  06:38 AM ET

the Hall shouldn't even consider it....HOWEVER, MLB should ban players for PED's and banned players don't accumulate the stats to earn induction to the HOF.....thus resulting in PED using players simply not making it to the hall....

April 12, 2012  07:14 AM ET

This unwritten rule business is garbage. Either it's a rule or it's not.


I really like that line. And I mean that in the most general sense, not just limited to PED or MLB topics.

April 12, 2012  08:25 AM ET

I wasn't a fan of PED users in the hall for a long time, but I've lightened myv stance. Let them in. Call it cheating, call it what you want, but they players were doing anything they could to better themselves as a player. Hank Aaron and Willie Mays took Amphetamines. Babe Ruth too testosterone shots. Pud Glavin drank monkey testosterone. All were the best PEDs you could get at the time, and Aaron, Mays, Ruth and Galvin are in the HOF.

What really gets on my nerves about the entire thing is that because a lot of players in the late 80's-early 2000's used PEDs, it makes every player that played in the time frame a suspect. I really get aggravated when I hear a player with deserving numbers didn't get voted into the hall because of suspicion of using PEDs. Let Bonds, McGwire, Palmeiro, Clemens, etc in the hall. Let all players with deserving numbers from the era in the hall, and move on to the next era of baseball.

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April 12, 2012  09:04 AM ET
QUOTE(#10):

If MLB let's ANY of the current or former players directly associated with the **Steriod Era** into Cooperstown I will lose all respect for the game and probably stop watching. I don't care if one of the oldest says in baseball is...If you ain't cheating you ain't trying. Or however it goes. The players that have been busted during the "Steriod Era" of baseball should never see the inside of the HOF simply of their totally illegal assualt on the MLB recordbooks.

So Greg Maddux and his 88 MPH fastball that relied on precision and placement shouldn't be let in the hall because he played in the steroid era? The main reason I say let the users in is because not every player that played in the 90's used PEDs, but they are all guilty until proven innocent, and that ain't right.

April 12, 2012  09:10 AM ET
QUOTE(#11):

So Greg Maddux and his 88 MPH fastball that relied on precision and placement shouldn't be let in the hall because he played in the steroid era? The main reason I say let the users in is because not every player that played in the 90's used PEDs, but they are all guilty until proven innocent, and that ain't right.

if that ain't right, they should whine to the people that used PEDs and tarnished the reputations of everyone....it's just like dirty cops....it isn't just the ones that actually violate people's rights, but also the one's that know about it and do nothing that are also corrupt....these guys are injecting IN THE LOCKER ROOM in front of their teammates....every teammate that sees it and doesn't immediately call them out on it IS just as guilty since they are allowing it to continue...

April 12, 2012  09:11 AM ET
QUOTE(#11):

So Greg Maddux and his 88 MPH fastball that relied on precision and placement shouldn't be let in the hall because he played in the steroid era? The main reason I say let the users in is because not every player that played in the 90's used PEDs, but they are all guilty until proven innocent, and that ain't right.

you are misunderstanding what he was saying....not everyone that played in the 90's in connected to steroids....If Maddux has never been under suspicion, he would be fine....but people like Bonds, McGuire, Sosa, etc... would be forever banned...what they do is FAR worse than anything Pete Rose has ever done...

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April 12, 2012  10:20 AM ET
QUOTE(#15):

There has gotta be a few players in the hall already that did use PED's. For that reason alone, you can't keep others out. I might be wrong, but I'd bet there's at least one.

that's like saying that if one person gets away with murder, we should stop punishing everyone else for murder....

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April 12, 2012  10:47 AM ET

The problem I have with not allowing them into the HOF is because they really don't know how many players they let in that used PEDs before they tested for them. PEDs are not new they have been around a long time.

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