Throwdowns > Closed

Mitch_Woulf said 07/15, 10:12 PM
Is Johan Santana a good pitcher? the answer is yes. Was there a time when he was outright nasty? The answer is is still yes. Santana sadly has had a big injury that may keep him out. Santana only has 139 wins right now which isnt near as many as you need to make the Hall of Fame. There have been several really good pitchers that have not made the Hall of Fame, including Bret Saberhagen and Denny McClain both won 2 Cy Young's and did not end up making the HOF.

The Hall of Fame is not chosen from a 5 year stretch of dominance, it is judged over a whole career. Should Doc Gooden be in the Hall of Fame? He had a great 5 year stretch were he was a Cy Young winner, 4 time All Star led the league in Strikeouts twice, and had a great ERA. But he didnt have the numbers a Hall of famer should have when he was done with his career.

Santana isnt near as dominant this year coming back from Tommy John Sugary as he was in years past, which is a shame, it is likely he will never be the same. The Hall of Fame committee, doesnt give free passes if you were good at a time in your career, you need a good long career to make it, especially in baseball.

Mitch_Woulf said 07/15, 11:22 PM
Santana was very good in that five year stretch, but he is not even in the same ball park as Sandy Koufax. Koufax led the league in ERA his last 5 Seasons, winning 3 Cy Young's leading the league in WHIP 4 and Strikeouts 3 of his last 5 years. The kind of dominance Koufax had was arguably better then any 5 year stretch by a pitcher in baseball History. Something Koufax and Santana had in common was their big success really didnt start till they were 25. Koufax retired very early unlike Santana. Koufax also had 40 shutouts.

Saying that Santana was the best maybe 2nd best ( Halladay ) is true, and yes 5 years is a long time. 5 years is not a career though. Santana's stats are still good and above average, but especially in MLB 11-9 and 13-9 ( His last 2 seasons ) Consistently are not going to make the cut for the Hall of Fame .

It is true that Santana will be in the Majors for at least a few more years, barring any injury's, even 175 wins may be a stretch at this time though.

The Baseball Hall of Fame is very hard to get into, and with his stats he just shouldn't be a Hall of Famer with just 5 great seasons.

Mitch_Woulf said 07/16, 01:14 PM
Unlike Santana though, after the age of 25 Koufax was dominant every year until his early retirement, Koufax had 4 No hitters and 23 one hitters, that is the definition of dominance which shows why Sandy is deserving.

It is unfair to compare Dizzy Dean to Johan Santana. First off, Dean played in the 1930's. Everyone knew who Dizzy Dean was,perhaps the most popular pitcher in ML History. Dean played in a different time. If you want to make a comparison, Dean had 30 wins in 1934, along with 29CG in 35, and led the league in strikeouts his first 4 years. Dean was probably voted in because of what he did for baseball and how he was a household name, he drew fans and made more people interested in the game of baseball.

It is true that the prime of your career is looked at when being looked at for the Hall of Fame they still do look long term, where Santana's stats have not been completly lights out the past few years. Ryan Braun has been amazing his last 5 and a half years,up there with the best,if he gets injured and comes back and is average the rest of his career, ends up with lets say 1750 hits and 300 Home Runs, he would not make the Hall,why would Johan be any different?