Dutch stars say Howard Webb robbed them of win

I'd say Webb gifted them by not sending off De Jong and Van Bommel - seemed to unravel the match before it really got going. Once again, Webb negotiating a contest instead of officiating it: this becomes a no-win situation as both teams start to gauge what a ref will tolerate and it always leads to one or both teams feeling they were justified, when they actually aren't.

What Webb is guilty of is bad judgment. He never fully established a line between what was going to be acceptable and not acceptable, which effectively painted him into a corner and resulted in the most out of control World Cup game since that horrific contest between - hello - the Dutch and Portugal in 2006.

webb sucks. he gifted both teams and hurt them too. Fifa put on a horrid cup in terms of officiating.
fair play my ass

I thought the Ref was fair with his calls.....Even though I was rooting for the Dutch, I thought Spain deserved the WIN

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Originally posted by

Umm, Webb probably kept Holland in the game. The most amazing thing in this tournament was not Brasil going down in the quarters or Germany playing more like Brasil than Brasil. It wasn't Uruguay and Diego Forlan playing out his mind. It wasn't Maradona and his antics. It wasn't even Spain winning the tournament scoring a grand total of eight goals in seven games. No, the most amazing thing about this tournament was that Mark Van Bommel played seven games and only received two yellow cards.

LOL, couldn't agree more. They even said that during the game. One of the commentators could not believe he only had one yellow card going into the final. The officiating overall in this tournament was atrocious.

As for the Dutch, they should have been playing a man down from early in the first half in which case I think they would have given up several goals. So they should be thanking Howard Webb. He was bad but I think the Dutch benefited much more than Spain.

Spain for sure deserved the win. I think if anything, Webb got off the hook a bit with Robben missing that one-on-one with San Iker's kick save.

If Holland would have won, the officiating of that final match would have been scrutinized even more.

I don't mind so much that Spain won the tournament only scoring 8 goals. There were other teams that brought about excitement, and I can't remember a time where I thought the World Cup final match was a "great" match to watch. If anything, yesterday going to PKs would have made it more exciting, and maybe even fitting for the way both teams played yesterday, but over all- I feel Spain deserved to win.

I asked this on the Rafa Marquez thread just before this one popped up: what is everyone's opinions on this World Cup over all? I'm not talking about one particular match or one particular team- but over all what are your impressions?

I'd start by saying I am pleased and not at all surprised that it went off as a safe tournament. We didn't hear of murders or random attacks and I'd like to at least give FIFA and the South African authorities credit for that.

I hope South Africa can prosper from this and hope it doesn't come back to a case of the rich getting richer and the poor suffering even more.

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Don't feel a little better this morning knowing that your Azzurri and my Selecao are off the hook for the '94 final? Sixteen years I've had to live with the burden of knowing Brasil were involved in the dullest final in World Cup history. Thank you, Holland and Spain. You gave us the most entertaining third place game I can remember.

Honestly, that was the worst final in 1994 I've ever seen until this morass. I often wondered if that Brazil-Italy game had an affect on how football has been covered in the last 15+ years (and 10 years is a generation in televised sports). Overall, I'd say that game did more damage than good in the US because it did reinforce widely held stereotypes about the sport amongst the ignorant sector of the broadcasting elite. I find it fascinating today that - once ABC/ESPN reached past the usual cast of American broadcasting characters - all of the sudden the guys locked out found a reason to love the World Cup.

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Originally posted by

I love The World Cup, My boyfriend thinks the same with me. He is eight years older than me, lol. i met him via~ AgeLessMingle.CoM ~a nice place for younger women seeking richer and older men,, to interact with each other. Maybe you wanna check it out or tell your friends..love it.

I hope for your boyfriend's sake he isn't 25 years old or younger...

That's called statutory rape, young lady!

Wesley shows his true colors. Things don't go well for him and his first instinct is to point the finger of blame elsewhere. De Jong should have been watching the final 62 minutes from the dressing room, and Van Bommel could have been back there with him after his tackle on Iniesta that went uncalled. Frankly, Webb kept Holland from embarassing themselves further. I would go further and say that if anything, those early yellows on the Dutch insulated them in the sense that Webb really didn't seem to want to send anyone off in a WC final, so turned a blind eye to quite a bit.

So Madrid treated you badly after 2 decent, but far from spectacular seasons, Webb jobbed you out of a WC in which your side showed ZERO interest in playing, I'm curious what Inter will have done wrong if SAF does in fact come for him this summer...

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Originally posted by

Dutch looked rough, but Spanish diving took on proportions towards the end of the match in my opinion, to the point where I rule no Spanish fan can ever criticize Italians for diving again.

that gimme hope joachim song, the part about spain with the diving and cards, dead on after that final

On another note, I wanted to throw something at the tv listening to Lalas and Ruud say that Robben "should have gone down" during Puyol's challenge. Are you ****ing kidding me? I don't ever want to hear those two **** clowns criticize officiating when they encourage a player to go down when he has the ability to play through. To listen to those two say that his ego and wanting the glory of scoring in a WC selfishly took priority over getting the call... yeah dumb****, scoring in a WC final should be the ONLY thing you're thinking of on the pitch.

Consider it akin to hooking up with a big girl. Going down is NEVER an "option" and should only occur when physically forced to do so.

QUOTE(#15):

Originally posted 12:16 PM ET  07.12 by PootieTang.

Consider it akin to hooking up with a big girl. Going down is NEVER an "option" and should only occur when physically forced to do so.

... and when even death is not an option...

QUOTE(#13):

Originally posted 12:12 PM ET  07.12 by PootieTang.

Wesley shows his true colors. Things don't go well for him and his first instinct is to point the finger of blame elsewhere. De Jong should have been watching the final 62 minutes from the dressing room, and Van Bommel could have been back there with him after his tackle on Iniesta that went uncalled. Frankly, Webb kept Holland from embarassing themselves further. I would go further and say that if anything, those early yellows on the Dutch insulated them in the sense that Webb really didn't seem to want to send anyone off in a WC final, so turned a blind eye to quite a bit. So Madrid treated you badly after 2 decent, but far from spectacular seasons, Webb jobbed you out of a WC in which your side showed ZERO interest in playing, I'm curious what Inter will have done wrong if SAF does in fact come for him this summer...

well, He specifically was jobbed on the Free kick that hit the wall, and San iker tapped out. should have been a corner. poor reffing is poor reffing. regardless of who caught a lucky break when, he has every right to feel robbed of a call. and spain should feel they were robbed of playing against a holland at 10 or 9 mine when they should have

QUOTE(#15):

Originally posted 12:16 PM ET  07.12 by PootieTang.

On another note, I wanted to throw something at the tv listening to Lalas and Ruud say that Robben "should have gone down" during Puyol's challenge. Are you ****ing kidding me? I don't ever want to hear those two **** clowns criticize officiating when they encourage a player to go down when he has the ability to play through. To listen to those two say that his ego and wanting the glory of scoring in a WC selfishly took priority over getting the call... yeah dumb****, scoring in a WC final should be the ONLY thing you're thinking of on the pitch. Consider it akin to hooking up with a big girl. Going down is NEVER an "option" and should only occur when physically forced to do so.

he'd have gotten the calls just like iniesta did all game

QUOTE(#13):

Originally posted 12:12 PM ET  07.12 by PootieTang.

I would go further and say that if anything, those early yellows on the Dutch insulated them in the sense that Webb really didn't seem to want to send anyone off in a WC final, so turned a blind eye to quite a bit.

But wasn't this very obviously a part of their game plan?

I'm not being a Dutch apologist here, but I think they very clearly knew what they were doing. Same goes with Spain, after the first few questionable calls that could have lead to cards for very hard challenges and some very obvious clips by the Dutch players on Spain, the Spanish started to embellish more and more when there was contact.

As Milan points out- Webb allowed this to happen. It is funny that I didn't know that Webb was/is a cop from England. It makes perfect sense that he officiates the way he does.

I agree with Dynamo, this is all pissing in the wind... DeJong's kung-fu kick was a red in any other game... I'm sure Alonso is enjoying those cleat marks on his chest. Dutch= sour grapes...

The guys talk about the refereeing in the Holland v Spain vidcast this week:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NKuwjABpEGY

QUOTE(#17):

Originally posted 12:18 PM ET  07.12 by CU Tiger

well, He specifically was jobbed on the Free kick that hit the wall, and San iker tapped out. should have been a corner. poor reffing is poor reffing. regardless of who caught a lucky break when, he has every right to feel robbed of a call. and spain should feel they were robbed of playing against a holland at 10 or 9 mine when they should have

In any game you're going to have missed calls. There are those which tangibly impact the game (goal over the line, blown offsides that either gives or takes away a goal) and those like a missed free kick. Over time those balance out. Is Wesley trying to say that Miss Cleo has since confirmed that the free kick would have been in the back of the net?

Again, all of this is irrelevant if Holland is playing with 10 men at the 28 minute mark, they'd be lucky to not be completely out of the game by the time Wesley's goal that wasn't would have occured. And no one can deny that De Jong deserved straight red on that one.

This is alot of sour grapes IMO. If there's one thing that I do hate about the game, it's the one sport where you almost never go a match without hearing one side complain about officiating and talking about how they "deserved to win the game". Officials are in a complete no-win situation and until FIFA takes a real stance and starts handing out real punishment, it will get worse before it gets better and it has nothing to do with the actual officiating.

It is pathetic that the Dutch are whining about the ref. The Dutch strategy was predicated on knocking Spain off their rhythm. They decided that playing ugly was their best chance at winning. And they are lucky not to have lost one or more players to a red card in the first half. I lost a lot of respect for Netherlands.

QUOTE(#22):

Originally posted 12:29 PM ET  07.12 by PootieTang.

This is alot of sour grapes IMO. If there's one thing that I do hate about the game, it's the one sport where you almost never go a match without hearing one side complain about officiating and talking about how they "deserved to win the game". Officials are in a complete no-win situation and until FIFA takes a real stance and starts handing out real punishment, it will get worse before it gets better and it has nothing to do with the actual officiating.

I did tactfully disagree. Nobody could honestly sit here and say that Spain weren't the deserving side in this contest. They were clearly the better team. But this wasn't a game that demanded some form of technological enhancement to fix a key call and change the outcome (thankfully). What this came down to was a case - again - of a referee altering the possibility of the outcome and putting his heel into the flow of the game. If fans of both sides spend this much debating the ref, odds are: he was a terrible official. Webb should have tossed three guys in this game - De Jong, Van Bommel and Puyol.