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the only thing this story needs is a point.

Even if he was clean as a whistle I never really thought HOF for Andy

Joe Buck likes nothing more than to stir up stuff. He also seems to like to hear himself speak.

I think that Pettitte will kind of fall into the Don Sutton catagory: Very good, but overlooked. The difference is that Sutton had the 300+ wins, and made it to the Hall. Pettitte will not.

If he gets in the hall needs to revamp it's rules and become MUCH MORE SELECTIVE again.

Buck and McCarver are the most annoying crew in the business, even without this millionth example of their clear anti-Yankee bias. Whoever they're covering, I tend to turn the TV down and watch the game with the radio broadcast. Buck and McCarver are atrocious.

The real problem I have is that if McCarver thinks something you are almost forced by concepts like intellect, thoughfulness and sanity to immediately jump on the opposite opinion.

If Tim thinks a player is a candidate for the HOF you really need to put the guy under the microscope because McCarver rarely gets anything baseball related right....

At least Andy fessed up. He definitely went about it the wrong way and should've went to a doctor and got some cortosteroid injections but probably thought he'd never get caught like Rodgeroid.

Pettitte is a sinner as much as the next guy but he's to be admired for not lying to back up that snake Clemens.

Is there anyone who doesn't realize judging a pitchers ' performance/value/dominance on his W-L record is stupid? Well, except maybe 'T-Mac'? Pettitte is a very good pitcher who has had a fine career...and whose career ERA may end up over 4.00.

It's amazing to me that Joe Buck stopped kissing on himself long enough to actually make a relevant comment....

Anyone who thinks McCarver knows anything should read his book.... for a **** that spends a great deal of time telling us how smart he is, he sure is a dumb a*ss.... Rule 1 about baseball players & ex players: Most are dumb as a sack of hammers and have been doing nothing but playing ball since they were six years old.... I played through HS, and found it irritating that everyone was so damn stupid ....

The only person that is more annoying than Joe Buck is Tim McCarver. Both are egotistical windbags that only like to hear the sound of their own voice. They are the worst in the biz. Buck has a good voice and that is about it.....the same is true for football - he and Aikman are annoying as hell.

That being said, the days of the 300 game winner are coming to an end. In the coming years, the HOF is going to have to start looking at buys with 250 wins. Pettitte is similar to Mussina. Not a huge star, but very consistent year in and year out. If Pettitte pitches effectivly for 5 more years then we can have this discussion. Otherwise, his stats aren't there yet.

Sr, most people who play sports are ...how you say? ...jocks? Most jocks, not all, but most spend most of their time doing what? (espeically, when they are younger and have a notable amount of talent) Correctamundo: playing baseball, football and basketball. A fair amount of baseball plyers still come from... how do i say this in a PC way? ...the backwoods or swamps of their particular state or country. Thus, a fair amount of these guys are realitively ... aw, **** it dumb as a sack of hammers.

If Pettitte pitches effectivly for 5 more years then we can have this discussion
Me DUM DUM | 07/01/08, 09:24 AM

Since MLB is testing for PED's, I think the days of 41 yr old Cy Young award winners is over too. Pettitte is 36. His best days are over.

How is this guy even being considered? Like the cartoon guy said, if they let him in, they need to revamp the requirements. Good to above good pitcher but nothing outragious.

Since MLB is testing for PED's, I think the days of 41 yr old Cy Young award winners is over too. Pettitte is 36. His best days are over.

Wanted Man | 07/01/08, 09:31 AM
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Thank you for finishing my post. The word "IF" is a really big word....

What about Mussina though? He's the one we should be talking about. He's getting towards the end of a very good career. The guy has never been "great" but he has had a solid career and is still doing the job. If he could continue for another 2-3 years then he'd have a case.

have to agree with me dum dum, Joe Buck and Tim McCarver both have NO idea what they are talking about. they LOVE to hear themselves talk.. kind of like some guys on ESPN and Sunday night baseball

Andy Pettitte, is a revered person in NYC. If it was up to the NY fan Andy would be a first ballot HOFer. Andy howrever is not a HOFer as it stands now. If he were to go on a tear and pitch for four more years and say win 65 to 75 games in that span and pitch at about a .625 to .650 won-loss pct. *& get htta ERAA druing thta time under or around 3.00 then he might thave a chance at the HOF. i don''t see him doing that and thus his slightly better than average career will not get him into the HAll. His HGH usage I don't think would be an issue in keeping him out of the Hall. He wouldn't be a first ballot HOFer anyway so any protest votes by any writers with their panties in a bunch wouldn't mattter., While i have spoken and I wil lcontinue to speak out against PEDs, I believe Andy did not use PEDs over an extended epriod of time and I believe in the idea of forgiveness. He did have to have had the truth drug out of him but i believe he was torn between speaking the whole truth and involving his father in the public eye and firestorm surrounding him and the drug issue. A mistake, yes, but a forgivable one. (I hope I neither am being naive nor snookered concerning Pettitte but this is my position on his PED usage.)
Reagrdless I don't evn think Andy plays more than another year or two and that is not gonna get him into the Hall. Therefore this whole Hall issue is a moot point.

What about Mussina though? He's the one we should be talking about. He's getting towards the end of a very good career. The guy has never been "great" but he has had a solid career and is still doing the job. If he could continue for another 2-3 years then he'd have a case.
Me DUM DUM | 07/01/08, 09:39 AM
Has he even won twenty games? No no hitters. His WS record is nothing great and obviously no rings. His ERA is around 3.70 lifetime nothing great, but i guess okay for a DH league pitcher. Still not great. He is about 300 Ks from 3000. Bottom line he better be in the middle of a revival of his career and push for 300 wins or he ain't in. Kind of like a Jim Kaat or Burt Blyleven case. Very good for an extended time but just not good enough.

the argument about pettite is similar to the argument about Mark McGwire. Regardless of HGH or PEDs...neither has HOF stats.

I never understood the McGwire HOF discussions. The guy hit HRs and that was about it.